Killer Mentality (feat. Malcolm Delaney)

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to the Nil Podcast. I'm your host, Jermaine Dixon, here with my brother, Levance Field. Today we got a special guest, Baltimore legend, a guy who's been winning at every level. I feel like. I feel like in college, Virginia Tech got. Got snubbed on some NCAA tournaments, but we'll talk about that a little bit. Played at Thompson Catholic, ran the city, became an all ACC guard and one of the best players in Virginia Tech history. Went on to have a long and successful pro career overseas playing in Spain, Germany, Russia, Italy, and spent some time with the Atlanta Hawks. Now he's back home building something special with his sports bar and lounge. So Baltimore got his AAU program, MD 23 elite. He's giving back to the city that raised him. A true Hooper entrepreneur and leader. Welcome to the Nil Podcast, Malcolm Delaney. What's good, Maryland? [00:01:01] Speaker B: Appreciate y' all having me, bro. Took a little while, but as long as we can get it done. [00:01:07] Speaker A: Hey, no, no. You know, we definitely is gonna make this happen. Do you feel like your name get the respect it deserves in Baltimore? [00:01:16] Speaker B: Nah, Honestly. And it ain't even just basketball. It's. Cause you know how our city is. Our city got their picks, and if you play the, you know, the hood politics, you always gonna be the fan favorite. And I never cared about that. Cause, you know, everything. I mean, we grew up together, so everything we, you know, we kind of did was always natural, but it wasn't never. We didn't have to do nothing extra to get no credibility. But I think the biggest thing with me is, like, when you talk about, like, athletes that ever come out of Baltimore, period, like, I'm probably the best one. Like, when you talk about basketball, football and baseball, like, people don't even talk about, like, baseball. A lot of people know me from football, but, like, I could have did it in any of the three sports. So I think that's the biggest thing. And that's just people that ain't really, really been around us, the older heads, you know, that ain't really tap into other sports. But I think everybody, you know, we grew up with kind of know, but, you know, I never really cared about. [00:02:15] Speaker A: Yeah, and it's funny you say that because I tell people all the time, looking at everybody pro career, where you talk about Melo, Sam, my brother Juan, Rudy, like every people had a lot a great career. And even though your time in the. What, you played in the NBA? [00:02:32] Speaker B: Three. [00:02:33] Speaker A: Two years. [00:02:34] Speaker B: Two years. [00:02:35] Speaker A: Two years. You played two years in the NBA, but your overseas career is better. Than a lot of people, career, period. So I always, I ain't gonna lie. Like, you know that Baltimore chat on Facebook, I don't jump on it too much, but I put you at the top. You and Melo. I got to give Melo that respect. And Lee, we claiming Melo. [00:02:55] Speaker B: No, for sure. [00:02:57] Speaker A: But I put you and Melo at the top as the best. The best come out of Boston. A lot of people say Sam. And I, Sam get that respect as well too. But mellow definitely at the top of me. [00:03:07] Speaker B: Yeah, Sam too, you know, that's my OG too. And Melo just. I mean, Melo is non debatable. Sam, just because, you know, his. His career in the league and then winning. But you know, like you said after them, like, and you know, there's been people that had good pro careers in the league and doing different things, but top to bottom, like, I was the best player in my, like in my grade since I was eight. Like, it was never even like a comparison to like, like one or two. Always been like separate. So it's like when I look at it, I look at it like that. Like, yeah, people could have had a good two, three years stretch, probably could have made some more money. They could have did some different things. But like, it never was. Like, you know, we had our rival with like DEZ and Lil Eric when we was growing up. But as far as like the top person in Baltimore, I never, like, it never was nobody above me since I was playing. So. Man, and some of those guys, you know, like. And you know, like my big brothers, like, Melo wasn't the best player when he first started. Like, he, you know, until he got to high school, he wasn't the best player. Like Rudy wasn't the best player until he was a junior. So it's like when you talk about some of these players, like, I grew up watching everybody, you know, I stole everything from everybody when I was young. Cause my father coached him. But like, I didn't see anybody really that was older than me that really ran the city and you know, you know, Sam and them older. I didn't meet Juan until, you know, we played hoop it up together. And you know, I just met who Juan was. So I didn't know Juan growing up. But like, I just never seen it. [00:04:34] Speaker A: And you mentioned Vincent and that was another person for me. You know, we played at Madison together. I looked at Vincent and Warren were two. Vincent and Warren were two guys that I said, I looked at them two as the best players. Was those two of your Role models. [00:04:53] Speaker B: Of course. [00:04:54] Speaker A: Vincent. Vincent is definitely one of your role models. [00:04:57] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. You know, Warren was like my big brother, and we, like, we all grew up together. I. Every practice they had, I was there, you know, I mean, every trip, every tournament, I was there. So. Yeah, but I used to still, like I said, with Worm, with Vincent, Vincent was more a football player, but he still, you know, he hooped. But, like, with Rebo and Tyler and all them, you know, I grew up. That's where I stole all my stuff from. Like, it wasn't. Of course I would watch NBA and, you know, I mean, I wasn't Jordan, but, you know, I try to still start with my AI and stuff like that, but my whole game came from Baltimore. It's like I stole bits and pieces from everybody that I've seen growing up just because, like, we had some tough guards and, you know, that mentality, there's always, you know, the underdog mentality. I seen them so much that, you know, they was my idols. Oh, go ahead. [00:05:45] Speaker C: I was going to say, hearing you say that, similar to me growing up and people in my neighborhood. When did you realize, like, all right, you know, I'm going to take this serious and I could do something with this basketball thing. [00:05:58] Speaker B: Honestly. Honestly, bro. Like, I fell in love with the game at, like, when I was five. Like, when I first literally, like, I was a Hawk, bro. Like, I used to do my homework in school, come home, go outside, hoop. Like, you know, I had a. I was. We had the only basketball goal in my yard, and it was just like some dirt and rocks. Enough spot, like, enough space for one car. And we used to have a whole neighborhood, you know what I mean? We got power lines back there, so you couldn't really. You couldn't shoot from far. But I just was. I was a competitor, bro. And it wasn't even just like, falling in love with the sport. I think I fell in love with just competing. Like, I always wanted to try to be the best at whatever I did. I think, you know, once, I think we probably got like, 10. I think, like, a website called Be More Hoops came out. Like, it was like, now they starting to talk about rankings and who better? Now I start to see, like, names like Nolan Smith, Chris Wright, they like, oh, you know, the DC guys is better now. It's like, we gotta take this a little bit more serious. And then it just kind of put more of a chip. So I think, you know, like I said, I was always kind of good, just naturally, because we never, like, I Never worked out. Like, it just was always having fun with it. But once you. Yeah, once we started getting competitive, when it's like, all right, Baltimore versus D.C. somebody ranked above you or he better than you, then I really, like, locked in and took it serious. So I'd probably say, like, when I was like 10, I really, like, I want to go after everybody after that. [00:07:23] Speaker A: Even though you say 10 because I'm two years older than you. Yeah, you played up, so. [00:07:30] Speaker B: Yeah, I was always playing up. [00:07:31] Speaker A: Yeah, Malcolm was. Malcolm was eight. Malcolm was eight. Playing on our team and killing, though, like busting. Busting dudes ass, bro. [00:07:40] Speaker B: You get better and that's it. Nobody really knew my age. Like I said when I was five, like, so when I was five, that's when Melo first came to Baltimore. Like, when they talk about Melo coming to Baltimore, like, him and my brother played on the same AAU team that summer when they was with Madison. And so when they went away, you know, I was on the bench. Like, I was. I had a jersey on. I'm running layups even when I barely could get the ball up. Like, I'm. I'm there. So it's like Malcolm dad was the coach. Yeah. So, okay, yeah, so I'm. I'm. People see me five. It was only 10, 12. We didn't have like eight, 10 back then. We didn't have eight and under. We had like, it started at 10:12 where we played at. So I was five. So by the time I got to actually play 10 and under, people like, yo, I didn't see you for this many years because I was always around. I was always playing up. But I never got to play my right grade until I turned like 10. That's why I'm like, you know, when I turned 10, it was like, all right, now I can kind of. I'm still playing up because it was 10 12. I'm still playing with 12 year olds. But that was kind of my age group when I finally got the age of 10. [00:08:43] Speaker A: Hey, so you started at McDonald. You played at McDonald for. Played there for a year and then went to Towson Catholic. What made. What made you transfer over to Towson Catholic? [00:08:53] Speaker B: So the biggest thing was me, me stop playing football. So, you know, the. And looking back at it, bro, it's like one of the. One of my biggest regrets probably is stop playing football. But like I said, I'm super competitive. And that was like something that played a part in it. Cause I went there, you know, as a freshman, I played varsity football and Basketball. So I didn't even expect to play varsity football. I just wanted to go have fun. Cause was playing jv. So I'm like, you know, it's a big football school. You know, I know how this go. Let me just go kill jv. Cause I'm. You know, we used to play JV a year, then go play varsity. And first day of camp, they like, nah, like, we ain't bringing you here to play jv. So I'm like, all right, well, now I'm back in that competitive mode. Like, it's like, I see the quarterback. I'm like, nah, like, I'm better than him now. And that's just me. Like, I just came off a national championship with Northwood. You know, we just won the national championship on espn. So I'm like, oh, now I'm competing for a spot. But I didn't know. Like, yo, he a senior. It don't matter how good you is, you're not about to get the spot. Like, I didn't know the politics. Nobody taught me the politics. Cause I never had. I didn't have really an OG like that. And my brother played jv, then played varsity. So when I went into that situation, I'm just going through the season, I'm not playing. It's the first time ever in my career where I didn't play in either sport. So I'm just not playing. They see me unhappy. I'm like, yo, you know, I can help the team. So now I'm in practice. They put me at receiver, they put me at db. They putting packages in just to get me involved. Just because they knew I was good, they wanted to keep me happy. But I was a quarterback, and it's like, bro, if I can't play my spot, then I just. Honestly, bro, I just lost love for it. Like, I woke up one day and I called my father. I'm like, yo, I don't want to play football. And he was like, huh? Because they basically handed me the keys. Like, after that year, they like, look, we went. They made me pick out the uniforms. We had new helmets. Like, they like, yo, we gonna do this. And with offense, we wanna run. I was about to change the whole system at McDonald's. And so when I went and told the coach, you know, they was like, nah, like, the agreement is you gotta play both. And I was like, well, I had just broke my hand, my shooting hand. I was like, yo, I'm just not feeling it. Like, if I'm not feeling it, I'm not playing. So it was a whole big thing up McDonough. I don't wanna get too deep into it, but they kind of turn their back on me because I didn't want to play football. And, you know, the basketball coach was like, yo, I think, you know, after hearing the stuff I hear, you should leave. Who was the coach? It was Coach Matt, and he ended up leaving the next year after Duane left. So it was just like a big thing. And I just. I was like, yeah, I'm gonna just. I'm gonna just get up outta here. I didn't really fit in there anyway. But if I could have, like, if I understood the politics of it, I probably would have never left McDonough. Like, if somebody could have sat me down, like, yo, you know, through my freshman year, like, yo, look, this is how it's gonna go. Cause, you know, my next year, my receiver was a lottery pick, a top 10 pick. We had Darius Hayward Bay. You know, he broke every record in Maryland. So I would have, like, it would have been easy for me to do what I needed to do, but nobody taught me the politics. I was just super competitive, and I was like, man, if I'm better than somebody, I need to play. And you know what I mean? That took the love from the game from me. [00:12:03] Speaker A: Yeah, so now you go over to Towson Catholic, and we're not gonna go year for year. But, you know, you won Gatorade Player of the Year. That was your senior year, right? [00:12:15] Speaker B: Yeah, senior year. Yeah. All Matt, bcl, MIA and Gatorade, y'. [00:12:20] Speaker A: All had a. Y' all had a stack roster. [00:12:22] Speaker B: Yeah, we had a mob, but it was, you know, me and Tay really spearhead and everything. And that was one of the big reasons why I went to tc. It was like, you know, that was Dante Green. Dante Green, Yeah. So everybody from Mount Royal, you know, TC was a. Was a Mount Royal school. So it was like, you know, we had like, five or six people from my team that was at TC already. So when we started making the decision on what schools, first, they wasn't gonna let me play in the MIAA or the bcl. They was trying to do a transfer rule. We got that, you know, overruled, and they let me play. So, yeah, I wanted to play with Tay, bro. Like, Tay, I seen, you know, we had a big. We don't have too many bigs in Baltimore, right? And it was like, you know, we was playing together that summer. I'm like, yeah, this. You know, this might work. And then we had a couple other players on there. That I felt like it was good. They had a black coach. You know, the school was cool. You know, I had family that went there. So it was like, man, if I'm gonna go anywhere in Baltimore, I really wanted to go to, like, a Dunbar or something, but my parents weren't gonna let me go to public school. So, yeah, I decided to make that move, bro. Cause I felt like that they would have put, like, we was on the national stage, and that was one of the coaches that knew how to handle that. So, you know, playing with Tay, it just. I mean, we had some fun them couple years. [00:13:38] Speaker C: So you named all them awards you was able to win while you were playing well at the high school level. How was the recruiting process for you and who started recruiting you first and how did it go? [00:13:51] Speaker B: So my very first offer was after my freshman year was LaSalle. It was Han. So we went to LaSalle team camp. That was my first offer. That's really when I was like, all right, like, you know, I'm a lock all the way in on this because I was still at McDonough at the time. And, you know, we went to team camp. He came on the court and offered me, and I was like, that's when I clicked to me, he was like, I got my first offer from basketball, and I really don't care about football. I'm like. And I was getting interest in football, and I barely played, but it was just like having a coach walk on the court, like, while we were playing, like, it's a dead ball. And offered me my first scholarship. It kind of changed my mind. And I think Gary Neal was there at the time. So I knew G. Neal, so it made me feel kind of special. He was like, you know, we got a Baltimore guard. He just played with my brother at Calva Hall. And then I get offered from them, I'm like, yeah, I'm gonna take this serious. And then my sophomore year, once I got to tc, it just kind of took off. You know, we had. You know, of course we had Maryland right there. I think my second offer came from Maryland. Then I had, like, Clemson. It was all. It was pretty much all ACC schools. And then I think the plan was for me and Tay to go to the same school. So it was like, whoever was recruiting both of us, that's all we was paying attention to. So it was like, you know, Maryland, Georgetown, like some of them other schools that was close. But then they kind of backed off of Tay for some reason. So it was like everybody else, like, Maryland backed off of him, it was like Clemson and Syracuse picked up. And once Syracuse picked up, he committed early. So that kind of, like, Syracuse didn't offer me until, like, my end of junior year when I was already kind of hot. And even with that looking back, like, I had, like, Pitt, I had Louisville. And it's crazy. It's a funny story. Like, I didn't look at no schools that was wearing Adidas. Like, bro, the craziest thing. Like, the crazy. I was so, bro, Nike was taking care of us so much. Like, in high school. It was just like, bro, I swear to God. And looking like. Again, looking back at it, like, I definitely should have looked at Pitt, like, Louisville, like, you know what I mean? Like, at the same time. But it just was like, man, I want to play in the. In Baltimore, bro. It was like playing acc, that was just like, the thing. It was like. So it was all ACC for me. And then I wanted to play against, like, Duke, Carolina. So that's just what I grew up on. I grew up seeing acc and, you know, so, yeah, it started picking up, bro. And then VTEC was always on me. But they was Adidas at first, and I never paid them no attention. Like, I was like, man, like, uniforms was trash. I see them. I see their whole swag, bro. They had. I remember this, bro. They had black and red T Max. They didn't even have team color shoes. They had black and red T Max, bro, with the. With the Virginia Tech colored jerseys. I'm like, man, I would never go there. You know what I mean? Like, never. And then Wake was my dream school, and I took my visit to Wake my junior year, and I was gonna commit. Like, I was trying to get it out the way, you know, CP and Justin Gray was like my favorite guard duo in college, and if they would offer me, I would have committed. You know, Skip Prosser was on me. We had Tim Fuller, who was my guy. That was CP guy went down there. They played VTEC. Coincidentally, Ad Visio had 40 on Wake and they beat him. And Virginia Tech had just switched to Nike. Like, they went from Adidas, switched to Nike. Wake didn't offer me. And when I left that visit, I'm like, damn, they made us come down here. I was trying to commit. Then I seen AD Retello get 40. I'm like, Bro, it ain't too many niggas in college getting 40. Or even college coaches letting people get a chance to get 40. So I'm like, all right, maybe I need to look at VTech a little bit. And Then, you know, I start paying attention to Jamal Gordon and Zabian Dowdell, and I'm like, man, they got the toughest backcourt in the acc, for real. And they dogs like, it ain't no big name. Like Greenberg just letting them go, and then all of them graduated. So it's like, that was, like, how it kind of came into play. It was just, like, once I seen that it was open for me to go in and play. Like I said, my competitive spirit, like, of course I want to go in and compete, but I felt like I was good enough to go somewhere and play and. You know what I mean, and bring something to the team right away. Once I seen they had three guards that was graduating when I was coming in, it was like, this is my opportunity. Like, I can go in, you know, get better and develop. But, you know, that kind of happened faster than I thought. But that was kind of how it went. Like, once VTEC and I seen the opportunity, I kind of blocked everything else out. Like, didn't care for Maryland. I didn't like how Gary Williams recruited. I didn't want to really do that. [00:18:28] Speaker A: I wanted to ask you that. How was that? [00:18:29] Speaker B: Yeah, he recruited terrible, bro. I met him three times. He said the same exact thing all three times. Like, it just was like, he never met me. He just like, yo, kept tossing me his ring. He like, yo, if you want to win, come to Maryland. I'm like, bro, don't nobody from Baltimore care about Maryland, bro. Like, you, You. He going about it the wrong way. You know what I mean? Then they was trying to send Keith Booth on us, and it just didn't work. It didn't feel genuine. And, you know, I would have loved to kill back home, but like I said, once he did that to me, I was like, man, I want to kill Maryland. Now, that was another thing. It was like, now I want to be able to come back home and kill him. So, yeah, VTEC just made the most sense for me. But, yeah, I would have definitely looked back at Pitt, Louisville. Them schools was on me heavy. And I just never even never paid attention to them. [00:19:16] Speaker C: It's crazy. [00:19:17] Speaker A: Oh, go ahead. Go ahead, Lee. [00:19:18] Speaker B: My bad. [00:19:18] Speaker C: It's crazy you say that, Malcolm, that about Adidas and you went to a Nike school. Cause in high school, I was gaucho, so I was Nike, too. Like, Nike took care of me. My senior year, high school, we went to Nike. So all I knew was Nike. I was Nike, baby. I played in the Jordan All American, and I committed to Adidas school. So when I get there, they like, yo, you only could wear Adidas. I was like, what? Like, I ain't even process that. And I think about that, like, how you say that, man, I'm happy with the Pit, but I think about like that I ain't really think about going to a Nike school. When I think about it now, like, I was just like gung ho on going to pit. [00:19:52] Speaker B: Die hard. I was Die hard. Nike, bro. Like, I ain't. You couldn't. Like, I didn't wear. I think we wore Adidas My 1590 year when we was Baltimore select. And then I ain't touch. But I didn't wear another brand like only Nike or Jordan until probably I went and played in Munich in Germany and we had to wear Adidas. But like, I even in the league, even anywhere, bro, until this day, I've never hooped in another brand shoe. Like since then, those two years, the only two years, yeah, I've never wore nothing else. Like, turned down deals. Like when I got to the league, it was like Adidas was. They was just handing out stuff. I'm like, nah, let me go check with my rep. They like, nah, bro, we gonna take care of you. I'm like, all right, that's cool, bro. I don't even need no money. Just make sure my gear, you know what I mean? Make sure I get all my stuff that I need. I wasn't even tripping about the bridge. I was so loyal, bro. And just now, it just now seeing the nil stuff and all the other stuff, I'm like, man, I don't care about no brand. Like whoever gonna make sure my kid's good is, you know what I mean? Like, I still prefer Nike, but at this point, my mentality is a little bit different. Cause I'm not playing no more, you know, It's a little bit different. [00:20:58] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. [00:21:00] Speaker A: When you said that, talking about, you know, you only look at the acc, I felt the same way. And it's a Baltimore thing growing up, like, we only watched it like Maryland was on. We get some Georgetown, but Maryland, you see Duke, you see Carolina, you see, you see Clemson was good wake ACC network. Yeah, we watching that. And I didn't think about another. I didn't think about a big ech school until I got until for me, until I got to Juco. And even, you know me, I wasn't a big time recruiter out of high school. So it was, you know, I was going to Juco anyway. How was, how was, how was Seth Greenberg? [00:21:36] Speaker B: That was my guy. Bro, like, and not even just basketball wise, because it's. I mean, it's probably coaches that could have did better jobs with developing me as a pro or whatever. Like, you know, people got their specialties. But the biggest thing with him, bro, is, like, he. He actually cared about you on and off the court. It was like, you know, I committed there because, like, he was one of the coaches that didn't lie. Like, it was. He kept it. Kept it real. You know what I mean? He talked to both my parents. Like, nobody was really talking to my mother when they was recruiting me. I think he won her over. Once he won her over, it kind of was like, all right. Like, it was an easy choice because on the basketball side, I was already sold. I didn't even care I was gonna go there. Before I even visited, before I went on my visit or anything. I already knew I was going there. It was just like, that feeling was like, I always been in situations. I can adapt to any environment. So if you put me in the right situation when it comes to basketball, I don't care where it's at. Like, as long as the basketball good, I'm cool. And so I kind of. I went on rest in peace. Keon Carpenter, he took me on my first unofficial. I think they played Clemson in my junior year. And Karp went to vtec, played football, played in the league. He was like a family friend and became one of my mentors. But, you know, once I went on that visit, I'm like, all right, basketball, it was lit. I'm like, the culture was football. But it's like, you can start to see, you know, basketball starting to get a little bit more notoriety. And like I said, with the opportunity presented itself, like, Greenberg came in, and he was. He took. He took over full control of the recruiting. And once he did that, I think, you know, I was sold. And like, I said, all he had to do was tell me, bro, I believe in you. I'm gonna give you an opportunity. And, you know, he didn't say, like, yo, I'm gonna get you to the league. Like, I wasn't even thinking that. You know, going into my freshman year, I wasn't no 1, 2, 3, and done. I wouldn't think about it. So it was more so, like, longevity, how he was gonna make sure I was good, you know what I mean, on and off the court. And he definitely took advantage of, you know, his relationship with my family. And it was an easy. That was an easy choice for me. [00:23:34] Speaker C: What was the biggest jump for you coming? Baltimore High school scene, going to the. [00:23:38] Speaker B: Acc, playing point guard. I think I never. I never played point guard. I was a combo. I could make plays. Like I was a playmaker. Like, I could. I always had, like, high assists and did stuff just because I had the ball in my hands. But I didn't understand how to play point guard, you know what I mean? I never played a lot of pick and roll. Like, me and Tay, like, we were just so good in high school. It was mostly isos and a lot of stuff like that. But I didn't know how to play pick and roll. I didn't know how to control the tempo of the game. The only thing I really knew how to do was get fouled. That's how I controlled the tempo of the game. But, yeah, that was it, bro. I went in. Like I said, we had eight freshmen. Day one, I didn't start. Like, we had a pure point guard who came in from Vegas late. My brother Hank Thorns. And I was pissed about that. I'm like, bro, this just. They just signed it. Cause he played 17 9, and then he signed late. So I'm like, bro, I committed. Signed early. I'm like, bro, they just brought this in from Vegas and this started. And I'm like, bro, I'm like. But they was just like, yo, we want a period point guard. So I'm like, all right. You know what I mean? I ain't tripping. It's my freshman year again. I'm not even thinking like, NBA or trying to kill. I'm just thinking like, shit, I'm in the acc, bro. I'm trying to get my feet wet. And then, like, 10 games in, we literally playing at the Garden at the Holiday festival. We always played there during Christmas, and that was when I got my first start. And it kind of took off from there. [00:25:06] Speaker A: Who was that? I was gonna ask, what was that game where you felt like, oh, yeah, I arrived. I'm here. [00:25:14] Speaker B: Yeah. So I think freshman year, I kind of had. I had a couple good games, but I wasn't being super aggressive. I was being passive. Like I said, they was talking about they need a peer point guard. So I think I went to. Yo, let me try to do my best to be a point guard. I'm trying to stay on the court. I ain't trying to make too many mistakes, you know what I mean? Just trying to fit in with what they needed from me. And then I think we might have played. I think it didn't really hit me, bro, until we played an ACC tournament. I think I kind of. Towards the end of the season, I kind of started. My momentum started picking up and I was super confident. I started shooting it well. And then going into the ACC tournament, I think I had like two big games. I had like 15 on Carolina and 15 on Miami. No. Yeah, 15 on Miami. We beat them advance and then we met Ty and Hansborough. We played them in like the semifinal. I had like 15 or 16 on them and they beat us like, pretty much at the buzzer. And then like, that just changed my mentality going into, you know, sophomore year that, you know, now I really think I can put up some numbers, but I didn't think it was about to jump from where it jumped from. [00:26:24] Speaker A: That was a crazy jump. Did your sophomore year, is that when you moved to point guard? [00:26:28] Speaker B: Yeah. So I started. So from that point on, I started sophomore year, I played point and then they would use me combo when we brought in some young guards. But I always played on the ball. From end of freshman year all the. [00:26:43] Speaker A: Way through, the ACC was stacked. Who was your toughest challenge? [00:26:51] Speaker B: So freshman year, that's when we had Jack, Tony Douglas, Tyrese Rice, Ty, you had. I forgot who he had a Duke. Duke didn't really have a good point guard. They had like DeMarcus Nelson, somebody else Wake had Ish. And Teague was just coming in there. He wasn't really killing that much. But the ACC was loaded at the point guard position. So it was like freshman year. I went into it, I'm just like, I'm holding my own, but it's like once I see I can hold my own against him, that's like I said, that kind of built my confidence. And then going into sophomore year, that's when wig had blew up, you know, that's when Teague had became Teague. We had like those young guys starting to come into, like Carolina and Duke. It was like Elliot Williams was like a high regard. Nolan was starting to do his thing. But once we got to sophomore year, I was already. Once we started sophomore year, I think, you know, I went into that summer, I told my strength coach, I'm like, bro, like, don't let me cheat. I don't care if you gotta watch me every time we're in the weight room, like, I'm like, bro, I need to get more bounce. I need to get faster. Like, you know what I mean? I know I can do something now because I had that confidence. I stayed the full summer session sophomore year, and like, I locked in, you know, I gained some weight, felt myself getting more Athletic. And I just was in the gym. And soon as the season started, I just felt it translate. It's like the first game had like 18, then it was like the second game had like 18. Then I get like a 20, 25. Then it's like a month go by, I'm averaging like 18 or 19. I'm like, Shit. Like I'm like, you know what I mean? I gotta figure out a way. But I had figured out a way to get easy points. And I think it just. I figured it out as a sophomore. And the ACC still, like I said, they still were stacked. Like WIC was number one. I think for like a couple days we beat him. And everybody had the hype. And we still, like I said, the Baltimore and me, like, they weren't really talking about me. Cause I didn't really have that big name in the acc, but. And just as Virginia Tech, period, we were still a football school. They weren't really saying nothing. They just said, oh, this is a tough team. You know, they got some tough players. Jeff killed the freshman year. So Jeff had all acc. He was the name going into sophomore year. And then it just clicked for me as a sophomore. [00:29:10] Speaker C: Just speaking to you, obviously just meeting you, I could tell you just a super confident dude. Super confident player. So like you said your sophomore year, was it just like knowing you belonged and obviously Coach Seth putting the ball in your hand and you just feeling more comfortable at the one position knowing how to manipulate the game? [00:29:30] Speaker B: Yep. And it was like, like I said once I once I locked in, bro. Cause I never really trained until really until my senior. I didn't have a basketball trainer until college. So my junior, senior year, I started lifting weights. I used to go. We had this dude that used to a trainer that was in the hood. I used to go after school every day and lift. But he had literally was in his basement. He had a couple weight sets. It wasn't no real training. We didn't do no agility, none of that. It just was, yo, let's take some creatine, let's lift. Like that's all it was like, you need to get bigger. But I never had a basketball trainer like I never was in a gym like doing like, you know, we just hoop. I was just hooping. So once I was able to get the gym access, you know what I mean? I had the access to managers that I can just call, you know, I just got super confident. Like once I felt it, like I said, once I seen that the work from the summer started translating to What I was doing going into that sophomore year. Then it was just like now, like, I held my own as a freshman. Now it's sophomore year. Like I said, when I start seeing 20, 25, it's like, man, I can score, you know, with anybody. Now it went back to kind of high school mentality. Now it was just like, go. And Greenberg was like, we had rules where it's like, yo, I don't care if it's one on four. He like, you get a rebound or you get the outlet, like, you gotta put pressure on the defense every time. He's like, I don't care if you shoot it or not. He's like, you have to make them respect, you know, your aggressiveness. So that's. That was the turning point. Once I, like, put it in my mind, like, attack every time, it kind of became easy. [00:31:03] Speaker A: Forgive me. Cause I. I'm forgetting the dude name. What was the athletic, light skinned dude on your team? [00:31:08] Speaker B: Daron Washington. [00:31:09] Speaker A: Duron Washington. You, Washington, and Jeff Allen. And I think that was your sophomore year, right? [00:31:16] Speaker B: Freshman year. [00:31:17] Speaker A: That was your freshman year. He was only there your freshman year. [00:31:20] Speaker B: Yeah. AD was there. Visaya was there. My sophomore year. The Puerto Rican scorer. [00:31:26] Speaker A: Yeah. So it was your. Okay, so it was your freshman year. I felt like y' all should have been in the tournament for sure. [00:31:32] Speaker B: We went. I think freshman year, we went 8 and 8. And then the ACC. If you went 500 in ACC, you're guaranteed to get in. Like, guaranteed. And I didn't even trip about that. It was like, well, I did, but it was like, it wasn't a big deal. Cause it was like, it was vtec. It was my. My freshman year. I'm like, all right, bro. I'm playing in nit. It's cool. We ended up playing Morgan. I'm like, man, we playing. You know what I mean? We get to play Morgan. But I didn't trip about it. And then I think sophomore year we went 7, 9 in ACC, but we had beat like a number one. We had beat, like, we beat ranked teams. And yeah. So it was just like, all right, we didn't get to 800, but we had the wins. But they always tried to discredit us. So sophomore year was the only year where I felt like, all right, they didn't really. They didn't. They didn't fuck us over on the tournament. It was like, all right, whatever. We got the wins, but we were 7 and 9. I let that one go. But then, like, I think we went junior year, we went like 9 and 7. And senior year, we went like 10 and 6 or something. Like, it was like 9 and 7. We was like the first team ever to win that many games in history and not get in. And senior year, we beat Duke on college game. Like, we had college game day in Blacksburg, like, never happened before, and beat number one Duke. In Blacksburg. They said we was guaranteed to get in. Still didn't get in. So it's like, you know what I mean? Like, freshman. I think we should have made it at least two out of four years. But three out of four years, we should have made it. We had seven and nine teams getting in over us at nine and seven. Like, Georgia Tech got in with Shump and Derek Favors. It was seven and nine. We swept them. Like, we never lost to Georgia Tech in my career, but you know what I mean? They had big names, they had whatever, and they was getting in over us. So like I said. But it got to the point, like, my senior year, I didn't even believe we was getting in. It was just like, bro, let's have a party. I'm like, I don't even wanna have no party. I'm like, and we wasn't even gonna play. We literally, bro, we had a meeting. We didn't have no practice before the nit my senior year. Because once it happened, somebody called Greenberg early. So I think the second bracket had came out. And all the coaches. I'm looking at the coaches. Like, I'm seeing teams that shouldn't be getting in, getting in. And I'm like, hold up. I'm like, but we not even, like, first four in, first four out. Like, they had us in. So when I seen it, I'm just like, you know, all the young guys hadn't really been through it. So I'm just like, they joking. I'm just sitting back like, bro, there's no way they gonna fuck us over this year. And Greenberg got a call. So Greenberg got a call. All the coaches went outside. Everybody like, yo, I think that's a car. I'm like, nah, bro, that shit ain't good. I'm like, ain't no way. That's a good call. So he just came back in there, bro. Slammed his phone. Find out who the fuck that is. Somebody text him, basically saying that we didn't get. We didn't get the nod. And it was before the brackets even came. Like, the rest of the brackets even came out. So he was pissed. So I'm just like, bro. Like, I'm like, nah, bro, I'm like, nigga, this my mind you. I had put my name in my junior year, and I came back my senior year, and it was already stuff going wrong. Like, we had. They had us preseason number one my senior year. We had. You know, Allen Chaney had the heart issue, so he couldn't play. He had transferred from Florida. It was another Baltimore guy, 6, 9. One of my starting backcourt mate had broke his foot or something. He ended up red shirting. Our, like, our power forward toward his shoulders, like, towards something in his shoulder. Then another person or another four, man, towards acl. Like, a week before the season started. So, like, I came back to school. I'm like, bro, I'm only coming back because, you know, they was like, yo, you can raise your. You can only raise your stop. And I came back to school like, bro, fuck it, we going to acc. We really could have. And then all that started happening. So it's like, n. We still. With the roster we had, we still came through and did what we did and then get the nod. So I'm like, bro, nah. So we was like, but we ain't playing. We told Greenberg, like, we not planning in nit. I was like, bro, I'm not doing four years in nit, bro. And so he was just like, man, look, just take two days and we'll think about it and we'll talk. And then he called us like, man, look, you got a group of young guys. We had Eric Green coming behind me. He was like, man, like, one thing I ask for you, bro, is just to leave on a good note so these young guys can, you know, jump into your footstep. He's like, but you passing the toys to Eric. I believe in him. He was like, the one thing I want you to do for me is, you know, go finish the season and have those guys walk into something next year. That. That's pretty good. So I did it. But, bro, we didn't want to. Like, we didn't practice or nothing, bro. I think we. I forgot who we played the first game, but we was. We was over it. But it was just like, fuck it, bro. Let's go compete and pass the toys to the young guys. [00:36:12] Speaker A: Yeah, that's crazy. So that. And you playing. That was off the strength of Seth Graham. [00:36:17] Speaker B: Yeah, that was it. But we. He said he had a meeting with the seniors, and we was like, nah, we. Cause we all. We talked about it. I'm just like. I was like, bro, I don't want to do it. He's like, bro, we'll let the young guys do it. I'm like, bro, this. Cause it really felt like it wasn't even us, bro. I think they didn't like Greenberg. [00:36:32] Speaker A: They ain't like Greenberg. [00:36:33] Speaker B: It was like they had something against him and it was. You know, it put effect on everybody. It just. I don't know what it was, but it's like, bro, they did not want us to get in. [00:36:42] Speaker A: Cause I was. [00:36:43] Speaker B: I was. [00:36:43] Speaker A: I was gonna. I was gonna ask, did you think it was. Cause I think around that time was when the Big east started getting eight and nine teams in. [00:36:52] Speaker B: Yeah, I was getting a lot of teams in. Yeah. So it was. It was. It was never a Big east team, though. Like, it was always like a. A mid major west coast team that got in. Like, it was Never like a St. John's snuck in or like, I wouldn't even care. But it's like it always was teams that definitely shouldn't have been over us or teams that we beat or team. You know what I mean? Like, or they would discredit us because we would beat North Carolina and they'd be like, you know, they was number 13 when we beat them, and then they fell off at the end of the season and they were like, oh, they got all freshmen, but they got Harrison Barnes and all these guys. Like, when we beat them, they were supposed to be this top team. But now you just grant our wins because they didn't end up being what y' all thought. So. It was a lot, bro. It was a lot that went into it. But yeah, bro, senior year, we was. We lost that nit game, bro. I was gone the next day. [00:37:43] Speaker C: I was just so. Having your mindset like that already not really wanting to play, but, you know, doing it for your coach and ushering the guys after you. What was your mindset? To get ready to shift, to get ready for the NBA? [00:37:56] Speaker B: Yeah, I was already locked in, bro. Like I said when I put my. So my whole. My junior year, I played hurt. So I had. I had like a grade two sprain and like a bone bruise. And I heard it, like, probably like the fourth game of the season. I played hurt the whole. No, it was my ankle. [00:38:14] Speaker A: Hold on. [00:38:15] Speaker B: So I played basically like, I played on one leg my whole. The year I led the ACC and scoring. I was hurt, and so I was getting an injection the whole season. And so if you, like, if you look at my numbers, like myself, my. I always shot a lot of free throws. But my junior year, like, I led. I probably shot like almost 10 or 11 a game in ACC play. And it was mainly because I was hurt. Like, it was. I just had to figure out a way. Like I said, I can adapt to anything. But, like, you can go back. I'll show you pictures, bro. It was times where I was hooping. I never wear team shoes. Like, I had to wear, like, team shoes a size up because I had to get taped. And I was wearing ankle braces. Like, I never wore ankle braces in my life. So if you look back at, like, some old pictures, like, if I had on ankle braces or anything like that, people didn't even know. Like, I really was. Like, I was going through it. Like, we would play. I couldn't really practice. So. Yeah, bro. Like, it just. Like, my mentality shifted. Like, once I put my name in my junior year and I heard everybody say what they said about me. Like, look, you know, he late second round, could work his way into the first round. Got approved. He can play a little bit. Point. I'm like, all right. I see my group that I was going against, I'm like, all right. Like, I'm definitely better than, you know, some of these guys. I know I can get in the first round. But, like, it was just timing, bro. Like, my first. I had a flight to. Where else was it go? Cleveland. Yeah, I had two workouts, and mind you, my junior year was the first year they did that rule change. It was like, you couldn't stay throughout the process and go back. So mind you, like, this is all luck against me. They only did this one year. They changed the rule after that year. So we only had two weeks to decide. So I was done school. But they said, you know, you can't do a workout until every university is done. Everybody had to have the same plan, field, whatever. So I'm done school, but I can't work out. So I got two workouts set up. It was like, Cleveland, Portland. I was going straight to Cleveland from there. Go to Portland. It was the only two I could do in that timeframe. Get to the airport in Blacksburg. Only flight canceled is Cleveland. Like, literally, bro. Like, you know, the airport there is small, so it's like, flight canceled. So I'm in the airport for, like, eight hours, bro. I'm talking to my agent. I'm like, bro, what can I do? He like, bro, there's no other flights going out until tomorrow, and you supposed to go to Portland. So he was like, bro, the only thing we can do is fly you directly to Portland. So I sat in the airport, bro, for like, 10 hours, I go straight to Portland. Like, I missed the Cleveland workout and Cleveland was the team that was highest on me and go to Portland. I kill Portland. Like, kill it. And so I called my agent. I'm like, bro. I'm like, bro, these are the early entry. Like, there's no way. Like, they can't fuck with me. [00:40:57] Speaker A: So who in your workout? [00:40:59] Speaker B: I think that workout was like, Taylor Battle, who was it? Luke. Luke Babbitt. I don't even remember who was in that workout. But it was like, but it was. I just like in that setting, like that now I was already in the workout setting. One on one setting. Like, I just, I was already. And I was in shape, but my ankle was fucked up. And nobody knew my ankle was fucked up. So this is the first time I ever worked out without getting an injection or doing anything. Soon as the workout was over, I got on a plane, my ankle swelled up so. And I couldn't even walk. So I called my agent. He like, yo, they told me like, you look good. Like, da, da, da. Like, what do you want to do? I'm like, but I ain't gonna lie, I need to get my ankle checked out. And he was like, what you mean? I was like, but there's no way I can go through the process like this, you know, with my ankle band like this. I was like, there's no way I can have back to back workouts. I just did one workout and I can't walk. So they didn't give me time to make the decision. It was like, yo, I gotta go back to school because of the rule. And literally I went to a doctor in Vegas and they was like, bro, why are you hooping? It was like they shut me down for the summer. So, you know, I played that whole season hurt, but I'm the whole time I'm fucking my ankle up more because I felt like any game I missed was gonna be opportunity, you know, for me not to be seen. So I always played. And then it was just like, yo. They was like, you gotta sit down. So they set me my whole. Going into my senior year, that whole summer, I didn't do nothing. I just therapy trained, did what I had to do, but I couldn't do no basketball. And so I was already in the mentality like, bro, once the senior year over, I'm done. I knew the lockout was coming. My agent, I had a good agent, he told me, he was like, yo, next year it's gonna be a lockout. So he was like, look, we gonna do what we can, you know, if you get drafted, it's gonna be great. He's like, but I'm telling you, if they got you in the second round. He was like, I almost would mind if you didn't get drafted. He was like, you know, you're good enough. He was like, I'm gonna have a deal for you overseas. He was like, we're gonna get you some money. And then if you come back when the lockout is over, that's cool. Or he's like, I want you to go overseas and kill your rookie year so you can come back and play summer league next year. And then we got a real deal. So it kind of played out. I was already in the mentality of, like, it was a business at the time. Like, we had set my whole senior year up. Whereas, like, I didn't have. I had already. I could have graduated as a junior. I had took all my hard classes and knocked them out the way. So I didn't have really no school my senior year. So it was strictly basketball. So it was like, once I was done basketball, I was done. [00:43:26] Speaker A: You did something. And I wanted. I know we got a few minutes. Not that much long. But I wanted to say you did something. [00:43:35] Speaker B: You. [00:43:37] Speaker A: You signed. I believe it was your. I believe it was after your senior year. You signed overseas, and then you went to. [00:43:47] Speaker B: I signed before the draft. [00:43:48] Speaker A: You signed before the draft? [00:43:50] Speaker B: Yeah. So we didn't. Remember that. Remember that year we didn't have. It was no summer league. My rookie year. Oh, well. Well, my senior year. My senior year was no summer league because of the lockouts. So I signed. But I had already signed before the draft. So regardless if I would have got drafted or not, my agent had plugged me in with a good situation, and I was already like. I was already good, so I never even. [00:44:13] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:44:15] Speaker B: So I was already signed. And that was that. That, like. I think that attracted a lot of NBA teams to me because they. They seen I had a different mentality. Like, I had. My friends didn't know nothing about the lockout. They like, bro, lockout coming. I'm like, but what y' all gonna do? Like, you gonna get some money? You gonna play? They like, nigga, we gonna wait. We chilling. We taking. They was taking loans out, doing different stuff. I'm like, I'm about to go get some money. Like, I ain't no money. I was like, I'm about to go over here. And then, you know, that helped my game out too. Cause I actually got to play more pick and roll like, you know what I mean? That was a change. I think that was the biggest changing point in my career. [00:44:49] Speaker A: You're overseas. [00:44:50] Speaker B: Yeah. That first experience, like, seeing pick and roll, like, playing that. That was the first time I ever really played. Because I didn't really play pick and roll at VTech. I being able to. The game slowed down for me, and that definitely, like, that helped me out. It slowed me down. I was. I still was aggressive, but I wasn't just like, score for. Like, it was only either score or assist. Like, it wasn't. No, make the extra pass to get to another pass. I wasn't even. That wasn't a rule for me. It was just like Greenberg, like, yo, your first. Like, you coming off the score, and then. You know what I mean, if they trapping you or then you pass it. But I didn't have, you know, overseas, it's like, man, that weak side corner, I never knew nothing about that. I probably didn't throw that pass one time in my college career. Like, pick and roll, weak side three. Like, never. It just never was a thing. We didn't drill it. We didn't do, like. We just didn't do it. So, you know, that. That definitely opened my eyes up, that. [00:45:41] Speaker A: Hold up, Lee. Hold up. Hold up, Lee. Before you go. Before you go. I think. I think that's a Baltimore thing as well. I know, Seth, but in Baltimore is straight, get a bucket. [00:45:51] Speaker B: Yeah. And like, you open right there. You might. Yeah, go get it. Other than that. No, I'm coming out. [00:45:58] Speaker A: That's what the first person I seen. And I think it's the difference between Baltimore and New York. That motherfucker would throw that pass across. It's something I. I didn't see. Like, I'm. Fuck that. That pass. I'm trying to get a bucket. I think that's just a Baltimore thing. [00:46:14] Speaker B: No fact. [00:46:14] Speaker C: That's why I'm laughing, man. Cause it's like, yo, it's crazy to hear that. I mean, like you said, that's what's got system. That's what y' all was working on and doing. And in our system, we was. They were big on assist to assist. That's what we proud of ourselves on, like, you know, making passing the extra pad. I can't tell you how many times I got that, like. And it's like, that's what made our team. So when I hear you say that, it's just. [00:46:39] Speaker B: Yeah, it was total. It was total opposite. [00:46:41] Speaker C: They screaming at extra pet. Like, that was the big deal at our school. [00:46:45] Speaker B: Yeah, we Ain't had none of that. It wasn't no extra pass, even with me. Unless they extra passing. To me, it wasn't. [00:46:52] Speaker A: Yo, Melvin, I didn't have the career y' all had in college, but I got my shots up, bro. [00:46:58] Speaker B: Like, nah, you definitely did. You found your way and got comfortable. But like you said, y' all had a good system where, like, if you was solid and you fit into your system, you was gonna play. Like, y' all just had players that can. Y' all could plug into spots. Like, that was like. That was another thing that I liked about the Big East. It was a. The conference was hella guards, but it's like, every teams played a little bit different. But it was just like, on the offensive side, like, y' all all played like that. Ball movement and shit like that. Every team had it, and I used to see it. I'd be like, damn, these. Like, I'm looking at it. And then Greenberg, he wanted. It was just. Bro, we was Michigan State. Like, our whole scheme was Michigan State. He like, man, he bringing Izzo. He like, man, this is what Michigan. I'm like, nigga, this be tough. I'm like, bro, I don't. Bro, we not Michigan State, bro. Like, we can't run. Like, we ain't got. We ain't got no Michigan State bid, bro. [00:47:46] Speaker A: We can't do this. [00:47:47] Speaker B: So we. I'm like, in Blacksburg, man. We get. Get some buckets. They got Jeff here, D.C. just. He wants four. When he get the ball, his head down. He's trying to score. When I get the ball, I'm. I'm gonna get my 20. Regardless. I'm. It did it. I just figured the game out. So it is like, we. We definitely didn't have that discipline. [00:48:03] Speaker A: Yeah. And talking about pro. And I don't want to go, you know, team for team year for year. But your first year, we speak about it in France and the team. Chalon. Chalon, yeah. You won the French League championship there. [00:48:22] Speaker B: We won everything. We won the cup, the French League, the preseason won, and then we lost in the Euro Challenge final. [00:48:31] Speaker A: The Euro Challenge. You was in Euro Challenge? [00:48:32] Speaker B: Yeah. So we lost in the. We lost. But they were stacked. They had, like, Bessie Toss. They had, like, Carlos Arroyo, Pops, msu. Like, they had that. Like, they had. That's the year Darren Williams was there, like, for the lockout. So it was like, they had. Their budget was just crazy. But we. Our highest paid player was probably making 180,000, 200,000. You know, they had multiple people making over M. So it was like we wasn't even supposed to be there. Then we ended up playing our worst game. We could have beat them. But, yeah, we had a great. We won three cups. My work here. [00:49:02] Speaker A: And then you went. And then you. And then you went to Ukraine. [00:49:06] Speaker B: Yep. Killed. But that's the crazy part. Another story that summer I come home, mind you, Cleveland come back. Yo, come back, let's do some summer league. I'm like, all right, cool. Cleveland back. So I commit to play with Cleveland. They called me, like, two weeks before summer league. Like, yo, Kyrie want to mind you. Kyrie didn't play summer league because of the lockout. So they like, oh, Kyrie wanna play. So we don't have a roster spot because Kyrie gonna play. And then we got two G League players. So I'm like, all right. Waste my time. I turned down hella other teams because I thought Cleveland was the team. And then got a call from Detroit. They like, yo, you know B. Knight gonna play one or two days. Cause he had just started. Like, he started the whole season. They're like, B. Knight gonna come. We need a backup. What you doing? Like, I'm. Man, I'm leaving Orange Mills, going downtown to go to. I'm going to Blue Moon, bro. I'm in the car. My agent like, how fast can you get to the airport? I'm like, well, I got somebody with me, but I'll drop her off and I'll just go to the airport. He like, all right. They want you to have practice. So I literally, bro, went. Didn't have nothing. Went. Dropped her off, drove to the airport, flew to Orlando, got there. I had to go to the Nike. The Nike outlet, go grab some shoes. I didn't have no. I went down there with nothing, bro. And I went on. I seen their team. That's when Kimmy got drafted. They had Andre Drummond. Them dudes got there. And I'm like, all right, cool, nigga. They didn't play me like they played Cape. [00:50:33] Speaker A: Was you in? [00:50:34] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm fresh off. I'm fresh off the rookie you did. [00:50:37] Speaker A: Fresh off the run in. Ok? [00:50:40] Speaker B: I'm getting Euroleague. You know what I mean? I'm getting Euroleague. Look. So it's like, all right. I'm thinking, like, n. I just had a great year. They was on me last year. I proved I could play the point. I went to minicap in Cleveland, Killed minicap in Cleveland. They like, bro, whatever. You. You know, this your vision and pick and roll. They like. But you develop. They saying everything that I Needed to hear coming out, you know what I mean? A rookie year, and then they didn't have a spot for summer league. Then I go there, go to Detroit. I don't play the first three days. So now I'm looking crazy. Got Euroleague coaches coming to see me. I'm not playing. I'm telling my agent like, bro, like, I just ain't no rookie coming in this year better than me. So these second round and these undrafted players said, nobody be playing over me. And they was playing Casper where? And then it's crazy, bro. They like, be patient, but we gonna play you tomorrow. They played me, but on the game jersey, I had a different number than what they had on the practice. I signed, I tried to check into the game, bro. They told me I couldn't check in the game cause my number didn't catch. I said, bro, nah, nah, nah. That was the day I said, fuck the NBA, bro. Like, I real live, like, told you. [00:51:42] Speaker A: Said they was playing with you. [00:51:44] Speaker B: Yeah, I said, bro, there's no way. Like the day I supposed to get in, can't check in. And I just told these, bro, my number not the same. They like, no, it's cool. But they had to go to the hotel, get my practice jersey and bring it back. I'm like, bro, now it's in the third quarter. I'm like, nah, bro. I told my agent like, bro, this shit embarrassing. Like, yeah, nah, I'm not. I'm not going, bro. And I just. After that day, bro, until I played in the league, I just kind of chopped it up with the league. I was like, I'm gonna lock in on overseas. [00:52:11] Speaker C: And that's. I was just about to ask you that because mentally, like being in a situation like that, I was able to play overseas my first year in Russia and was a one league or whatever playing against Cesca and things like that. But my mentality, being honest, like, it may know when I first got my contract, he was one of the first people besides my family, my mother and him. I showed. He like, bro, what you better go over there. I was so locked in on. I'm. I'm an NBA player. Like, nah, yeah. I feel like I lost track. Lack of what I had good overseas. So when I. No, that's what I just want to allude into is like, what was your mentality to just switch and go. You know what? They ain't accepting me for what I got. Let me just lock in over here, get all this money over here, be a top player, become a big God star, go To Europe, et cetera. How did you turn your mentality to just lock in to go overseas and not. Not look back anymore? [00:53:08] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:53:09] Speaker A: So that. Before you answer that, let me just tell you. I looked at this boy contract and I said, ain't no way you tripping about the NBA, bro. Ain't no way you tripping about the NBA. [00:53:23] Speaker B: They was giving it off the rip, bro. [00:53:27] Speaker C: I was with Pops. [00:53:28] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, bro. Yeah, they was. They was giving it up. Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, just with that. I think that that set the tone for it. I think my agent already had a plan. He was just like, yo. He was like, bro, we know because, bro, even with the draft, they had me. Hold on. They had me best available like the last. I was like, top three best available, like the last 40 picks for the second. Like the second round, that draft. So my agent was like, look, bro, he was like, I know what you can do overseas. He was like, my plan for you is, I want you to go over here and become one of the top players overseas so they can come after you. He was like, I don't want you to chase the league. He's like, if you want to play in the G League, cool. He was like, we will have a contract for you tomorrow. He was like, but it depends on what you want to do. He's like, you can go make money. He's like, I know you can be one of the best guards in your league. He was like, but in three to four years, they're going to be coming after you with real money. He was like, I want you to go to the league on your terms. I don't want you chasing and doing. He was like, if that's what you want to do, we'll do it. But he was like, that. That was a plan he set for me. So I think that summer when they did that in summer league, it just set that plan in motion, like, even faster. It just was like, man, Like, I realized. I was like, man, fuck this shit. I stopped watching the NBA. Now I'm watching Euroleague. Now I'm watching. Like, I said, that mentality kicked in. It's like, who the best guys in year league? Oh, how much he make? Oh, he make this. And it was like, the first time I really seen it was when I went to. When I was in Ukraine preseason. We had Pat Bev. So Pat Bev had signed in Spartop in St. Petersburg, and they gave him a bag, mind you, again, like, dudes who played on Adidas circuit. Some of these guys, I never crossed paths With. So I'd never seen Pat Bev in person. I knew who he was, but you know what I mean, I just seen, you know, like, if somebody you're on a low budget team and you playing against a big budget team, all they talk about is the money. So my coach come to me. He like, bro, you know who that is? I'm like, yeah, like, it's Pat Beck. He like, man, you know how much you know his contract. So they just kept talking about money. And he like. And I'm looking. I'm like, oh. They like, oh. I'm like. He made what they said then. Mentality kicking. I'm like, oh, like, all right. I'm like, I'm making this much. This making this much. I'm like, hold on. That team got a budget of what they're back up making. I'm like, they back up making three times more than me. I'm like, nah, bro. So you know what I mean? Mentality kick in. We end up beating them. I hit a buzzer beater. Like, I hit the buzzer beater. I called my agent at the game. I'm like, bro, there's no way, bro. I need. I said, I need in. So he like. So he like, what you mean? And then we in the hotel. Pat Bev walk in. He walk in. I think he with his girl just come in. I remember this shit. But I tell him. I told him multiple times, bro, like, he motivated me to another level. Walk in with a big ass breitling on, like, yeah, I'm a bus down Brightland. They had hella bags. They just went shot. I'm like. And mind you, in Europe, it's like, you lose a game. [00:56:33] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, man. [00:56:35] Speaker B: We in there. I'm chilling in the lobby. Just walking in there with the bags with. I'm like, I'm like, bro, I respect whatever. Da, da, da. He rapped to me a little bit. He like, man, I'm trying to get the out of here. He's like, man, I'm probably gonna leave. He like. He was saying something about the NBA. He was like, you know, whatever. And it ended up happening. But he was like, yeah, bro, I'm trying. He's like, talking about getting out his contract. So I hit my agent again. I'm like, bro, this is Pat Bev said he gone. I'm like, bro, if he gone, I need that. Whatever bread they paying him, I need that. I'm like, so that was the first time, bro, you know, Draper, I was always cool with Draper, so I knew stuff but it's like, that's the first time I seen somebody again where it's like, yo, he getting paid this much. I need to see where I match up against with the competition. And then I seen everybody around him. I'm like, he definitely good, but the guards that's around him, I'm definitely better than them. So it's like, now that. That flip the switch is like, now it turned into. Now I got to kill everybody who's supposed to be making more money or, like, next year, bro, I need to get some bread. And it kind of clicked from that. It just gave me another chip on my shoulder, you know, playing over there. And you know that Eastern Europe money was different. And so anytime I got a chance to play against any of them teams, like, I just try to kill him. [00:57:45] Speaker A: Try to kill him. And then after that, yeah, man, now you can answer. [00:57:48] Speaker C: Ask question. But just real quick, yeah, that's the team I signed with. So that's what I was with that point. [00:57:53] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. They was kicking that out. [00:58:01] Speaker A: The next year. That's when you end up. The next year, you end up going to Munich, though, right? [00:58:04] Speaker B: Yeah, and same. So rookie year, we went to. Yeah, so rookie year, we got. We qualified for Euroleague. I left. They didn't have enough money, so I left France my second year. We qualified for Euroleague again. They wanted to bring me back, but they had problems with money. And I never had a problem personally, but I just seen where it was going with the team. They couldn't pay me. [00:58:32] Speaker A: That was Ukraine, right? [00:58:34] Speaker B: Yeah. So when Munich came, it's crazy because now my name is hot. And my agent was like, look, he like, you got a big decision to make. Mind you, I hit up. I wanted to play on Maccabi. Like, that was my. I just kept hearing about Maccabi. I'm seeing him. I'm like, man, I see Tel Aviv because we had just played in Jerusalem. I'm like, I'm trying to go live in Tel Aviv. So David Black was there. I hit up my agent. I'm like, he like, yo, what. What you thinking? I'm like, bro, I want to go to Maccabi. I told him, like, bro, he had a relationship with David Black. David Black was in the A. My agent in the A. He hollered David Black. He like, yeah, he probably one or two years away. So I'm like, what, nigga? So I'm like. [00:59:17] Speaker A: He said, you're one or two years away? [00:59:19] Speaker B: Yeah, from playing Abu Khabi. Mind you, they don't have. They don't have the Money. Like, they don't even have a lot of money, but it's just like. They just felt like they was one of the top. So I'm like, damn. I'm like, still, like, they still trying me. So then my agent like, look, I got a good situation for you. He like, munich came. He was like, it's not gonna be your biggest offer. But he was like, bro, if you play good for this coach, you gonna be stamped in Europe for the rest of your career. He's like, it's the craziest coach in Europe right now. They was like, but he wanted the most respected. He was like, I told you. He's like, I warned you about Serbian coaches. He like, this is the top one. He was like. He's like, if you survive this shit, then he was like, you gonna be good. So I'm like, it. I can play euroleague. I'm like, germany seemed like it was cool. I'm like, munich was a big brand, and they gave me the ball. He like, look, you need to go here. You're gonna play point guard full time. And at the time in Europe, point guards and picking pop forwards was getting the most money. Like, it was. You had to play one of those two. If you was good at them two spots, you was getting paid. So he was like, look, they not playing you off the ball. He was like, you gonna go here? You playing full time. He's like, you're not gonna play 28 minutes. He was like, you gonna go here. Y' all gonna have. You know what I mean? So I'm like, cool. I. You know, I was like, fuck it. I'm gonna take the challenge. And so I went there, locked in on planet one and just had a good year, and, like, wasn't chasing no stats, nothing. Ended up getting MVP. We ended up going, like, top 16. It was the first time they ever played in Euroleague. And so that. That year was cool. And then that's when I got my first NBA offer, you know, during the year, and it was after we played Maccabi, so the shit was like, bro, it just came full circle. But that year, like, he said it was gonna happen, that's what happened. And the crazy part, the circle back all around to that. I got my first offer because Pat Bev got hurt. [01:01:08] Speaker A: Wow. Oh, shit. [01:01:10] Speaker B: So I had the Rockets. I remember the year, I think he had broke his hand or something, like. And they was looking to bring somebody in for the playoffs, and it was because of that, all that shit came full circle. [01:01:20] Speaker C: That's crazy. I was overseas with. [01:01:21] Speaker B: And they ain't let me out. They didn't let me out. [01:01:24] Speaker A: How about I say, Cause you never end up going there. [01:01:26] Speaker B: Yeah, they. It's crazy. I had my two worst games. My agent called me like, yo, Daryl Mores and Jeremy. I'm like, fuck. I'm like, I hope the nigga ain't this even. These last few games, we had just lost. We had just lost in the cup. We got smacked. Thing om. Smacked us. And he was like, yo, I'm like, what the hell are they here for? He like, well, they're gonna be in Munich next game. Such and such, whatever. And so I played. I'm on my way home. He called me. He like, yo, pull over. So I'm like, he's like, no. He's like, what you doing? I'm like, driving home from practice. He like, pull over. So I'm like, what? He like, you might want to. He's like, you want to sit down and hear this? So I'm like, what's up? He like, rockets just offered 2 year. It was like 2 year, 3.6. He's like, they're gonna give you the mid level exception. Da da da. So I'm like, I'm just thinking about this shit. I'm like, hold up. I'm like, so I really pulled over, bro. I pulled over. It was like a McDonald's parking lot. I'm like. He like, yeah. He's like, bro, I'm gonna call. He's. I'm about to call your father. He's. I know he gonna want the news. So he's like, I'm gonna call your father. You go home. We'll talk about it later. So I'm like, bet. So I'm going home, bro. I go home. Look at the contract. I'm like, these really just offer me. Mind you, this is March. So the mid level exception, they had to get rid of the money. So I was gonna get that, the, the one year salary in whatever amount of months that was for the first half. And then I would get the full. The second half on the option. So I'm just looking at this. I'm like, I started looking at houses in Houston. I'm like, I'm about to. I was like, I'm signing this. So I, I talked to my father. He like, he was like, yo, you know they ain't gonna let you out, right? And I'm like, but I didn't have NBA out in my, in my contract because again, I wasn't even thinking about the league. I. I'm like, bro, I'm not even. I don't need the NBA out. He was like, yo, they not gonna let you out. He's like, you too valuable. So they called me the gm, like, yo, come meet before practice tomorrow. Whatever. I meet him, the contract on the table. I'm like, yo, this ain't gonna let me out. So he like, bro, he's like, you know I love you to death. He was like, man, you too valuable for us to lose. He was like, I don't care what amount of money they offer us, but we took half the salary, so I think it was automatic. They could pay like, 480. They could pay the team. 480. It was more than I was making that year. And it was only like a couple months left. I'm like, bro, y' all can go buy another player, right? Any caliber player with the regular buyout. And I offered, like, another 600,000 out of my own money. So we offered him, like, a million. It was like a million 1.1. I'm like, Bro, we'll give you this to let me go. He's like, bro, I don't care what they offer. We're not letting you go. [01:03:54] Speaker A: Damn. [01:03:55] Speaker B: He was like, you too valuable for the club. He was like, bro, we just, you know, we invested everything into you. The team is built around you. He was. I hope you understand. Da, da, da. I'm like, bro, that's just. I was like, man, this. That shit broke my heart. That shit broke my heart. But then it just was like. I'm like, fuck it, bro. Do I. Cause I could have just left and I talked to my agent. I'm like, bro, what happens if I just leave? He said, well, if you leave, there's nothing. There's no consequence, but you probably not gonna be able to go back to Europe. [01:04:24] Speaker A: He was like, go back to Europe? Yeah. [01:04:25] Speaker B: He's like, this don't work out. You're gonna have a bad name in Europe. He was like, so again, make the decision that you wanna make. And I was like, fuck it, bro. I see now that I'm right here in the league, like, now I can see, like, I seen a contract. Now I see a real contract. I'm like, now I know where I'm at. And whatever our plan was, was working. And this after year three, he said, you know, three to four years. And so, you know, I finished the season, ended up getting MVP in Germany, and, like, another bad summer. The summer when Bron went back to Cleveland, so everything stopped. Like, no NBA teams were signing People no, nothing. Like it was. Everybody thought they was gonna get Bron. So waiting for LeBron, we called Houston. Houston, like, yo, we waiting for LeBron. We want you, but we can't do nothing early. If you give us two, three weeks, we might be, you know, da, da. I'm like, bro, y' all just offered me. We just had a contract. Like, Bron don't got nothing to do with me. Like, I'm like, bro, this has nothing to do with me. But again, bro, he had the league on lock. And then, same thing my agent said happened. What's going to happen happened. Everybody started coming at me with a lot of money, and he's like, look, these motherfuckers ain't waiting three weeks. He was like, so now you get Russia. So I had, like, Galatasaray. I had Loco, and I had Olympiacos. Olympiacos try to buy me. They try to buy me out during the season. Yeah, they wanted me. We played them first round, and I was kill. Like, I was killing them. And, you know, like, Greek fans, once they see a player and they gravitate to them, they said they had to offer me because they never seen the fans follow a player like that, you know, after a game. And so I had those three Maccabi come back. Fuck y'. All. Like, they didn't have no money. So it was like, now. Now you're talking about. I'm a year or two removed now. You need me. Y' all don't have enough money now. So it was one of those things. It's like, do I wait around for the league or. And I was so, like, paranoid. I'm like, nah, bro, the league gonna fuck me over. So why would I give up this guaranteed money? I'm still young. Like, man, I'll try this again when I'm 25, 26, I'm like, if I can go get two years guaranteed. My first. You know, my first goal was to be a millionaire by the time I was 25. So it was like, I didn't care how it was gonna happen. Like, what it was. So once I started seeing contracts, I'm like, hold up. Nah, bro, I'm go over here for two more years, but I can sacrifice. Just put an NBA out of my contract. If they want to come get me, then they'll come get me. But at this point, I'm just like, man, now I'm at the top of Europe, so I want to make the most money possible, and I end up going to Russia. [01:07:00] Speaker A: Russia was your biggest bag until the league. [01:07:04] Speaker B: Yeah. So I went there, signed a two year. Our team was crazy. The first year, we, like, broke the record for Euro cup wins and then lost, like, the Final Four. Like, it was like an aggregate game. We ended up. We went on the road, won by like, 11, then lost by, like, 20 at home. And we. We was literally, bro, we supposed to win Euro cup that year, but the ruble dropped, so they cut our budget. So they was like, yo, you know, they was trying to find, like, teams for people to go to at the end of the year. They like, yo, if you could take this deal, bro, it's going to help us out. So people was leaving. I still had another guaranteed year, me and Aunt Randolph. So they was like, yeah, such and such. So I came home. Now everything picked up. Atlanta called me. This was the year before I went to Atlanta. My agent like, yo, Atlanta wants you to come down. They want to meet you. They basically told me everything they was doing in the draft. They like, look, they looking to have another guard to compliment Teague or Schroeder, one of the two. He was like, one of them about to go. So they gave us the whole rundown. They wanted to trade one of them during the draft, but it ended up not happening. And then I had my out in. My contract was for, like, July 15th. So, you know, once the draft and stuff was over, I didn't have much time. Once they couldn't trade one of them, they like, bro, we can't do nothing within this time. If you can wait, you know, we can make something happen. But they couldn't do it within that timeframe. So, again, bad luck. I gotta go back to Russia. The day I get to Russia, they're like, yo, we don't have the money to pay you this year, so if you can find a contract, you know, we'll let you out. So I'm like, bro, y' all just. I just wave my out like you. I just went past the date. I told teams that I couldn't stay home and play because I had to, you know, I had to obey my contract. I come over here, and I get here, and y' all tell. Y' all could have told me this at home, right? So I don't. I don't go to camp. Like, the first couple days of Camp, Draper had just signed over there with us. Draper had left, went to the national team. So I called him. I'm like, bro, I'm about to go. He like, I just came here because of you. Like, what you mean, you about to go? I'm like, well, they just told me they don't have no money for me. So we had a deal with, like, Shanghai. I think Shanghai was connected to the Rockets with Yao. And so they gave me a crazy. It was more money than I had in Russia. They contract written up. The coach called me like, yo, why ain't you been coming around? Like, I hear that you trying to leave. And this is the coach from Olympiacos when they try to get me from Munich. So he built the whole team around me. He like, bro, I came here because of you. He's like, you know, I wanted you for the last three years. He like, why would you want to leave? He's like, you know, I said, bro, they didn't tell you? He like, what? I said, bro, they told me they can't pay me. He's like, they don't have the money to pay me. So he was like, what? He's like, give me two hours. He's like, don't sign the contract. Don't make a decision. And he went and told him like, yo, if Malcolm leave, I'm leaving. And them calling me back like, yo. He's like, yo, come to the office. He's like, yo, they said they found the money to pay you, but I swear, this shit was crazy. He was like, we good. And again, like, ended up. We had a good year. We ended up going to the Final Four, you know, euroleague. And then at that point, it was just like, I probably. At that point, I was the hottest guard in Europe. So it was basically pick where I wanted to go. But the Hawks had came. We played in Barcelona, and the Hawks had came there in, like, December and was like, yo, we apologize. We couldn't get it done last year. We're guaranteeing right now that we'll have a roster spot for you. Da, da, da. So I already knew that whole season that, at minimum, I was going to be able to go to Atlanta. Like, it was like, now I'm starting to look at the league again. I'm like, all right, well, let me watch the Hawks play. I'm looking at them like, I'm watching them more than I'm watching everybody else. And then once we went to the Final Four, that's when kind of everything kind of came to light, where it's like, now I have, like, nine or 10 teams, but nobody was talking fast enough. And I was. I had just seen, like, okay, I had a deal. They played around. Now they want me to wait for somebody. So it was like, bro, I'm not even entertaining, y'. All If y' all not doing this. And I think we had a big deal in China, and my agent was like, look, this is what we gonna do. Final Four. We gonna meet with everybody. He was like, we're going to see who gets you the biggest contract offer, and this is what we going to use as leverage in the league. He was like, I know these Chinese guys. He had just signed Andre Blatch there. He was like, you know, I got Blatch. I know what they got. I know what they're going to offer you. He's like, let's go sit down with him. Let's just get the offer, because this what we going to take to the league. So we sat down, met with them. They put the money up there, and we just looked at each other, and my agent was like, all right, well, we not discussing money. So, you know what I mean? Me and my father walked out. He met with the team, and we kind of used that as leverage. So, you know, once free agency opened up, Atlanta was the first team to call. They offered me some. And he used that contract. He's like, look, he not coming back home unless he get at least this. So I was able to, you know, go into the league with a decent contract as a rookie. But, yeah, basically everything he said that the plan was going to be is what happened. [01:12:11] Speaker A: That's what's up, man. [01:12:14] Speaker B: Andrew. Andrew Vai. [01:12:15] Speaker C: Andrew Vaughn was doing this thing it was with. [01:12:17] Speaker B: So he's with asn. He's with Andy Miller at the time. And then to. Again to bring it back full circle. The GM that brought me to Atlanta was working for the Cavs. So that was the guy who came over to France and seen me. That's who I talked to in my interview with the Cavs. And, you know, he eventually got. I think when Danny Ferre got fired, he got moved up to gm. So he was the guy who brought me into Atlanta. So all that, like, the interview I did, like, all that stuff kind of came full circle because that was the same guy who gave me my first opportunity. [01:12:51] Speaker C: Do you feel like you got your get back? How your professional career ended up being that, you know, with things going to college or you being overlooked and whatnot, you feel like you got your get back? [01:13:04] Speaker B: Yeah, and I kind of, like. I kind of set up a blueprint for a lot of players. Like, I think Brad said that a lot of. Yeah, a lot of players was chasing the league, bro. Like, and it just, like. And Brad was one of them. Like, Brad was kind of. That followed, not follow My blueprint. But like, he, he put his work in and Europe became one of the top guards and he was able to leave on his terms, you know what I mean? Like, a lot of people wasn't doing that. They would. And I know some of my friends, they chased Gig Lee. They chased this shit for seven, eight years. And then they be like, oh, bro, I might come over to see. I'm like, it's too late. Like, you don't. You can't do that. Like, it's not how it used to be. So, yeah, I think for me it was just like I did it my way and I was able to do that and then make a decision on whether I wanted to stay in the league or not. Because, you know, I wasn't happy there. And again, I kind of fell out of love with the game, just with the politics and, you know, tanking and all that shit. Like, I just wasn't for it. But I was so used to winning. [01:14:04] Speaker A: You was playing good. You was playing good in Atlanta, bro. [01:14:06] Speaker B: Bro, and that's how the league is. Like my rookie year, I go in, we got the best bench in the league. You know, I got the probably. I think I had like a top three plus minus in the league. I was shooting. I was top 10 in mid, like mid range percentage, top five and turnover rate, like assisted turnover ratio. Rookie, like, everything was there. And going into all Star, I didn't get the rookie sophomore game. They was pissed. Like, it was to the point where they was calling the league. You know, they called me like, yo, we got an issue with you not getting picked. Do you like, do you even want to play in the game? They was like, cause if we go and, you know, complain to the league and they let you in, we don't want you to, you know, I mean, you don't want to play. I'm like, look, I got vacation set up, but of course I'm going to play in the game. You know what I mean? And I didn't make it after trade. I mean, after that we end up. They made a decision on what they wanted to do with the, with the team. So they traded Kyle Korver. And now we started to see like, oh, these like, yeah, he's like, bro, you trade Korver to the cast, they bring in like Jose Calderon. He didn't play the whole year. We bringing in people that, that couldn't play. So it's like I played 19 to 24 minutes every game, no matter what it was. Didn't have a third point guard and Then they like, yo, we. We want to bring an event to get ready for the playoffs, and they bringing Calder on. So I'm like, all right, again, n. Not better than me. I'm asking assistance. I'm like, bro, what's going on? He like, man, just kill him in practice. Like, just make sure, you know, we don't have no decision whatever. Kill them in practice. Media come in the game day, like, yo, like, how do you feel about Bud saying that you and Calderon gonna split the next 12 games or whatever? And I'm like, huh? And they like, yeah, they. Bud said he's gonna play. He gonna play him like four, Then he gonna play you four. And then so I'm like, yeah, I don't know nothing about that. So then they like, bud comment, obviously, like, yeah, you know, we. We didn't have a third point guard all year. We bringing in Jose. We gonna see how it works. Then we gonna put you back in, and we'll see. Make a decision going into the playoffs. I'm like, like. I'm like, all right, whatever. So he played. Don't play good. And then I play doing the same thing I'm doing. Then he like, yo, for the playoffs, we gonna go with a vet. We need a vet. And I'm like, yeah, bro. I'm like, this. This shit ain't it, bro. And then we go to the playoffs and play the Wizards, and they got Wall Bill and Brandon Jennis coming out the bench. We beat the Wizards, I think both times during the regular season, I played two good games against the Wizards. You put Calderon against Brandon Jennings, bro. Cooking him like, come on, bro. I'm just like, bro, this shit was. It was bad. And then that just kind of my mentality for the league again was back. Like, damn, bro. Like, I just. You know what I mean? How you go from vouching me for a rookie sophomore game to talking about you bringing somebody else in? Like, you want me change my day? Like, don't shoot, Midis. Shoot all three. I'm like, bro, I'm being productive. The first group is losing every time we get in. We bring y' all back every time. Like, we doing what we supposed to do now. You switch it. And then it was just like, going into the summer. I'm like, bro, what do y' all want from me? They like, look, you know, the roster's wide open. We rebuilding. He's like, ain't no nothing guaranteed. Dennis just signed the extension. He like, besides Dennis, nobody's untouchable. So I'm like, all Right, Bet. So now, again, I don't go home. I don't get my trainer. I lock in with the Hawks the whole summer, and I felt like, you know, I made a step. You know, I was shooting it. Well. Coming to preseason, I'm averaging like 12 and 5. I'm like, all right, cool. First game of the season, they played me 12 minutes. I'm like, they got gig league on the team. He's playing. I'm like, bro. Hold like. I'm like, bro, I just played well. I just had a great summer. Played well in the preseason. Then the first game of the season, we're on the road. You play me 12 minutes. I'm like, hold up, bro. Something ain't right. So then we play the second game. Same thing happened. I know when I'm supposed to get in the game. I know when I'm coming out. My second stint come, he calls somebody else, I'm like, nah, this ain't it, bro. I called my agent. I'm like, bro. Like, this my contract year, bro. I don't know what's going on, but I worked too hard for somebody to play with me again, bro. I bust my ass this summer, and this is a contract year, and I knew how important contract years was in the league. And so he like, yo, just play out this road trip. We'll talk about it. I talked to the coach. I'm like, bud, what's up, bro? You said, you know, a couple weeks ago, this the best you ever seen me look. I'm shooting it well, I'm passing, whatever. He like, yeah, man, we, you know, we kind of made a decision. We have a point guard in Dennis that's taking 20 shots a game. We don't want another guard coming off the bench being super aggressive on offense. He like, we just need you to play. You know how you've been doing on defense, we love it, but you gotta tone it down on offense. And I'm like, what? I'm like, bro. They literally at my exit meeting said, bro, next year, we need you to go back to how you played in Europe. They was like, we want you to shoot more threes and be more aggressive, like, open it up more. I'm like, bet, right? And then once I had that meeting with him, I'm just like, yeah, bro, I gotta get outta here. And so back full circle. I called my agent. I'm like, bro, let's figure something out. He like, all right, I'm gonna look around the league and see Houston. So Houston, we back. We back at Houston. And they like, yo, we would love to have him. They put a trade. I forgot the guy that was shooting underhand free throws. It was supposed to be. I forgot that he went to Louisville. I think he was a big man. He used to shoot. It's like onoaku or something. I forgot the name. But they had. That was the trade proposal. It was supposed to be me for him. And I'm like, cool. Somebody's like, yo, Houston, they want to do this, do that. Somehow Atlanta said something like, you know, I was valuable for the locker room, and, you know, I was starting to play well. So I swear to God, I go to. We play in okc. We play mellow in them. Okc. Coach pulled me up. He like, yo, I heard about, you know, your trade request. He like, you know, anything. He like, bro, you've been so professional here, you know, you've been doing everything we asked you to do. Any way I can help you, you know, get to a good situation, I'm gonna help. [01:20:26] Speaker A: This is Bud talking. [01:20:27] Speaker B: Yeah, Bud. He's like, right now. He was like, we love everything you bring to the team, but, you know, the organization is going in a different direction. So right now you're not in a 10 man rotation. So I'm like, all right, fuck it. Now I'm thinking like, all right, they gonna trade me. If I'm not in the rotation, trade me. Dennis decided not to play that night, and somebody else decided not to play. So he like, bro, the one thing I know about you is whenever I call your name, you stay ready. Whatever. They played me at the two. The first time they ever played me at the two. That night, I had like 20. So the best game I ever had after talking about the trade, after doing anything. So now the media like, why? Why haven't you ever played the two? And I was like, I don't know. I just do what they asked me to do. They was like, well, you look more comfortable off the ball. Like, I was like, bro, I'm a combo guard. I can play both. But I never had the opportunity to play. So now they asking, you know, why is Malcolm not playing? You know, I had probably like three or four DNPs. They like, you know, he looked good. Why is he not playing? But in my mind, I'm like, I know we tanking, like they happy when we losing, but now I'm like, shit, I could play the two, so maybe this will, you know, help me a little bit more. And then I went on, like a little stretch where I was playing well. I was Playing off the ball. And then I got hurt again. I hurt my ankle. The same ankle I hurt in college. I ended up hurting it. Like, it probably had, like, eight more games to go in the season. And they called me in the office, like, you proved everything you needed to prove to be here. You know, you showed everybody you belong in the league, so we gonna just shut you down for the rest of the year. They was like, we'll get you ready for, you know, the off season and figure things out. And then he shut me down, and then everybody got fired. So they fired. Bud was like. Cause that was the first time Bud ever missed the playoffs. And he wasn't fucking with it. And, you know, he was the coach and the president, so he was like, yo, if this is the direction y' all going in, I'm gone. Like, you know, so they. Our whole staff ended up leaving. And then I ended up getting surgery, which was the surgery I should have got in college. And I played eight years. Yeah. Or six. Yeah, I played six years on that ankle that I was telling you about that I fucked up in college. Had the same exact injury. So once they. Once I did it and they said it, I was like, yeah, I already know what it is. But I told them, like, would it be best for me to, you know, get my ankle cleaned out? And they was like, yeah, like, you got bone spurs. And a lot of. We. They. You should have been. Got it cleaned up. And I ended up doing it. You know, when I did that, when they set me out. [01:22:54] Speaker A: Okay, well. And I. You know, we definitely went over time, but this was. I. I love this talk, Malcolm. I ain't gonna lie to you. [01:23:01] Speaker B: Nah, you cool. We good. I know. [01:23:03] Speaker A: I know. I don't even say. I don't want you going to the China and Italy, but in Spain. But I gotta say this because, you know, I follow you on Twitter. [01:23:16] Speaker B: They the crazy stories, bro. [01:23:18] Speaker A: I see you going at it with the fans from. Is it Spain or Italy? [01:23:25] Speaker B: Probably span. Barcelona. [01:23:27] Speaker A: Barcelona. Yeah. I see you going at it with them all the time. [01:23:31] Speaker B: Yeah, they and that. It's crazy. Just. I mean, to make it quick. So the China. Shit. Um. So I only went to China, bro, to get my confidence back. Like, it was. Like I said after that Atlanta situation, I, like, I hated basketball. Like, it was. I just. I can't play. I can't lose. Like, on pretty much on purpose. Like, you. You know, you trying to lose. Like, that ain't my thing, bro. I just. I felt like I was being spoiled in the league with the just with the lifestyle and then just the basketball just wasn't there. And I just kind of lost myself with basketball. So I told my agent, like, look after. I want to get this surgery. I want to get healthy. I want to finally be able to, you know, play health, and I want to go somewhere where I can just kill. And so the same team that had offered me the deal in China came back around. And I was like, yeah, I'm gonna go over here, bro. It's a five month season. I can go, you know, we'll be able to come back for the NBA playoffs and I can just go get my confidence back. And then so I go over there same. I'm averaging like 26 and six. We the best team. We got three people averaging over 20. So nobody is. We ain't have a team where you had to get like 50 and 60. We had the best team. And then we go to. I remember we go to Chinese New Year. So we got like a month left in a regular season. And my agent was like, yo, did they say anything to you about going home or something? So I'm like, nah. He was like, well, the Chinese agent hit me up and saying they want to bring in two more players for the playoffs. So I'm like, why the fuck would they do that? But I think Marshawn. So Marshawn was sitting out, but he had something, you know, in China, they was in Marshawn. So I didn't. He came in when I left. [01:25:09] Speaker A: Okay, okay. [01:25:10] Speaker B: Yeah. So I think with Marshawn, they had to sign him by a certain time or they wouldn't be able to sign him for the next year because his team had rights or some shit. I don't know. It was something. I didn't really care. Like, once they was like, I was already going home because we had two weeks. We had a two week break. So I had my shit packed at the game. I was like, I'm going home from break. And one of the assistants was like, yeah, but if you don't come back, like, it was nice. Da da, da. So I'm like, so I called my agent. I'm like, bro, why the fuck this nigga just tell me? Like, so he lied. He's like, yeah, so no, I get home when I get home. He called me like, yeah, they just called. He said they want to bring in Marshawn and Mike Beasley. So I'm like, nigga, we already got two Americans. I'm like, why would they bring in two? Cause he was like, well, he was like, they saying that they're gonna sign Marshon for next year. And then I didn't know what they was doing with Beasley, but he was like, my contract was guaranteed. So he was like, look, you got two options. He was like, you can stay there. He was like, they said that they gonna rotate players. And I was like, bro, I'm not rotating nowhere. We was 36 and four. I'm shooting. The GM just asked me what was going on with my three point percentage. I'm shooting 44 from three. I'm like, Bro, these is retarded. Like, there's no way. Like, he just asked me that. And I'm shooting. Like, I'm really shooting the best I ever shot in my career. And so I just was like, yeah, this shit getting weird. But I had already got my last paycheck, like, my official paycheck. So I'm like. He was like, look, you got your money. He was like, we can negotiate your bonuses. He's like, you already got majority of your bonuses already. Y' all number one in the league. So y' all going to the playoffs. You know, we'll negotiate that. He was like, do you want to go back or would you rather stay home? And, nigga, I'm about to turn. I think, who is this? I was turning 30. If I'm not mistaken, it was my 30th birthday. So I'm like. I told him, like, man, just get my bread, bro. I'm staying home. I'm gonna celebrate. I'm celebrating that I'm going to Miami. So we ended up negotiating it. But once I demanded what I demanded, they like, nah, you gotta come back tomorrow. Like, once I say how much money I wanted for my bonuses, they like, nah, you gotta come back. I'm like, if y' all don't want me to play, why y' all want me to come back? So we ended up coming to agreement. I'm like, bro, I'm not leaving. So I ended up getting my bonus money, and I stayed home, went to Miami, and then the Bucs called, which was my staff from Atlanta had went to the Bucs, and they was like, yo, you know, we need a guard for the playoffs, whatever, come trial and make sure I was in shape. So they played in Atlanta. They came to the gym. I worked out. Paul Gasol was. And I think he waited till after the deadline to say he was going to get surgery to be out for the season. And that was the roster spot. So they was trying to wait and see. So they thought that they would Have a roster spot because Powell was hurt, but he waited till after the deadline so he can get that guaranteed money. And so I was. You know what I mean? I just. I didn't have a. It was normal roster spot, so I thought that would have been a situation for me. [01:28:09] Speaker C: And. [01:28:09] Speaker B: But I still was like, all right, well, I'm back. Like, back in shape. I just had a good year. I'm back. I want to go back to the league. And so I think we ended. I ended up going to New York that summer. Melo was trying to get back in the league. So me and Melo up there playing pickup. I'm killing New York. They want me to come back. I'm like, bro, I'm not about to keep coming back for nothing. Like, y' all gotta at least give me a training camp invite, a partial, something. I'm not about to keep paying my own money to come to New York and hoop with y'. All. So they didn't do nothing. I'm like, nah, go to State. Call went to minicamp. Killed Golden State. They called, said, yo, we want you to come back next week. Steve Care will be back. We got one more group coming in. And then on my flight home, Barcelona called my agent, and I seen the roster they had. I'm like, I'm on a flight and I'm seeing, like, they just signed Meredith. They just signed Corey Higgins. Like, and I told my agent, I'm like, bro, this team is. I'm like, this shit is crazy. Like, I got a chance to go in Euroleague. And, like, I always wanted to. Like, I wanted to retire in Barcelona. Like, before I went to the league, Barca had offered me, like, a four year deal. So that was the one team that really wanted me to come. My coach from Russia went to Barca. They thought that they was going to get all of us. So that was like a spot where I was like, all right, if I ever come back to Europe, like, I want to play in Barca. And so when that came about, I was like, again, nigga, I'm not about to wait next week for. I just killed the minicamp, right? I'm not waiting. And the season had already started, so they was like, yo, if you gonna do something, you need to come over here now because we got the cup next week. So I'm like, fuck. Like, I just, you know, set up all my stuff at home. I'm like, bro, I don't know if I want to leave to Europe this quick. But then I thought about it. I'm like, it Is Barcelona, like, I can go over here. You know what I mean? And they gave me the deal I wanted. I was like one of the first players to sign like a one plus one with a full player option. And so they gave me exactly what I wanted. And I was like, well, I'm gonna go here. I know I'm gonna kill the first year and then I'm either gonna go back to the league or I wanna sign like a three or four year and then retire. So, you know, that was the whole thing behind going to Barca. They kind of just. It set up everything I want. But the COVID thing kind of killed that. [01:30:17] Speaker A: How about I said that went into Covid year. [01:30:19] Speaker B: Yeah. So that. And they cut their budget. So I wasn't there. Yeah, I had already sacrificed. Cause I came with that. Yeah, I was like, man, I didn't already sacri coming here. They wasn't starting me, like. And mind you, this coach was the same coach from Munich. So I'm going to play for the same crazy ass coach. But I'm older now, so it's like I already know how to deal with them. I'm not really. But I'm not for all that. Yeah, like, look, I'm gonna come here, I'm a hoop. Treat me like a grown man. I'm gonna do my job. And like, I wanted to retire there, bro. Like, it was like I told the. We were negotiating the extension, but it was like I didn't. Honestly, I didn't want to play for him. Like I was. I like, I told the gm like, bro, if I'm here for three more years, bro, I don't know if I can do it with him. But it was like, it was both ways because once I left, they was like, look, we can't do nothing about that because y' all winning. And once I left, they lost. And then he ended up getting fired. So it was like, I'm like, damn, bro. Like, you know what I mean? But like I said, I wasn't going for it. I mean, that late my career I wasn't taking no pay cuts. And once I went home, they kind of did some wild shit in the media where they tried to act like I forced my way out. And they was leaking. You know, Spanish media is one of the worst media. So they was leaking all these fake stories about it. And once they started doing that, I lost respect for them. And you know, Messina had wanted me to come the year before and Milan wasn't really a top, like a top team at that point. So I Was like, nah, I'm not doing Milan. Like, I turned it down. And then he called as soon as I got home. He like, yo, I heard, you know, it's the possibility you might be able to leave Barcelona. I'm like, yeah, I'm gone. I'm like, if y' all give me what I want, ain't no. We don't gotta go back and forth. I'm. I'm gone. And so he was like, just let me know. Give me a number. I gave him the number. They came back. He was like, well, Mr. Armani, not like, we not cutting the budget. They was the only team not to cut the budget. And I'm like, shit. Soon as I heard, the moon see it, I see. [01:32:20] Speaker A: And he. [01:32:21] Speaker B: Yeah, he told me to plan like, he was. You know, Kyle Hines was going over there, some new faces. They already had a couple guys. Like, Sergio Rodriguez was already there. So I'm like, you know, this is a team that, you know, I feel like I can win with and shit. A good city. And, you know, Messina was like, yo, we doing everything. Spurs doing low management. Like, so it was like, when, you know, I mean, he said everything I need to hear. I'm like, oh, yeah, I ain't got to deal with. Treated you like a real pro, man. I ain't got to deal with no crazy ass coach. I'm like, oh, that's. Man, look, I probably played like four games in the Italian league my first year. Like, I was asking to play. I'm like, bro, I'm not in rhythm. Let me go. He like, nah, it's a long season. He like, we got 11 months. It's a long season. You know, we'll. As long as you fresh at the end. I'm like, damn, bro. I'm like, this. I don't know if this good or bad, but I'm like, I'm like, bro, nigga was rested, but it was just like, like, bro, I swear, bro, we went to camp. I'm thinking, like, we had to go quarantine for two weeks and then going to camp. We get in camp, practice, like an hour and 10 in training camp. So I'm like, we finished in practice, like, three turnovers. He like, man, what? Shut. Like, that's. It's a nobody shoot after practice, go home, we'll come back. I'm like, huh? Like, hold up. I'm like, this shit ain't real. Then we come back. I'm like, look, coach, I was like, I ain't gonna lie, bro. We can't. In practice like, that. Like, we. He like, man, just don't worry about it. It's a long season. I'm like. I'm like, bro, what the fuck? Like, he doing lockout days. Like, yo, don't come. I don't want to see nobody in the gym. The gym is locked. I'm like, dang. I'm like, bro, this shit, like, the league, like, once that, like, Milan was like, the league, bro. Like. Like, that shit was top notch. And that's why, like, I was cool with standing, you know, the last couple years. But, yeah, that Barca was, like, a disaster, but Milan was, like a breath of fresh air. And, you know, in regards to the treatment, and that was the best place I could say in Europe that, you know, you get treated like a pro. They not worried about what you doing. Of course, you can't do no wild shit. But off the court, they not. We got every meal, we got wine. You know what I mean? Like, it ain't no brand. [01:34:27] Speaker A: Said same thing. Now think about it. Italy. [01:34:30] Speaker B: Yeah. Like, it was like, I'm life. Like, damn. You go to any other team that you go to the bar, you gotta sneak a. A glass of wine or you want a little drink. You night. The night after the game, you guys walk by, you hiding. I'm like, you get to the table in Milan, bottles of wine, Y' all want wine. They come around pouring that shit. I'm like, yeah, but not that. That was. And just to, you know, moving forward. Like, I got a good relationship with them. Like, I'm. My AAU program is sponsored by Armani. So, like, we just renewed, and I'm pretty sure we're the first team to be sponsored by them in the US for sure. And we just renewed, you know, recipes and Mr. Armani. But they just renewed the contract for another year, so I'll have that. They, you know, they give all our jerseys and shit like that. So just off of that, you know, relationship, they, you know, they want to do stuff with me moving forward. So, I mean, all that shit come full circle, bro. [01:35:27] Speaker A: And that's a. That's a blessing you deserve, bro. I ain't gonna lie. [01:35:30] Speaker B: It's just trying to change the game in different ways, man. Like, like I said, with all this stuff going on with brands, it' like I'm chasing Nike. Like, I got a whole two boxes full of EA7 jersey, you know what I mean? Like, it's stuff that people ain't never even thought about doing or being able to do. I'm just trying to use you Know my platform to kind of do some different stuff for the kids. So hopefully I can continue to keep building that. [01:35:54] Speaker C: No doubt. [01:35:54] Speaker A: Man, did you have enough? Did you have an official retirement? [01:35:59] Speaker B: No, I need to. You just like, I thought you did that. [01:36:04] Speaker C: I would have thought you had a party and all. [01:36:06] Speaker B: Hell, nah, I ain't, bro. And, you know, it was crazy. Cause it just was bad timing. Cause my. The first year I didn't play, and my agent thought I was joking. Like, I had got hurt my first year in Milan, and it just was. It just was. Mentally, it was fucking me up. Cause I couldn't really work on my game. So I had my meniscus, and it was just like, I played again. I played seven months, and then my knee locked up, and I had to just get surgery, and we kind of rested back, so I can play in the playoffs. I had a great playoff series against Munich, and then my body just shut down. And then I came home. But that whole year, bro, I had to go. I was the first one in, the last one to leave, but I couldn't do basketball stuff. It was always like, work on the knee, doing this, doing that. Yo, we want to rescue. We want to. So I didn't really get to, you know what I mean, do play to my potential, that. I thought they was happy with it, but I wasn't. And then, so going into my. My second year, you know, I told them, I'm like, yo, I'm going home to the Hawks doctors. I'm gonna do this PRP stuff. I'm, you know, let me do it my way now. Because that shit wasn't working. But I called my agent. I'm like, bro, don't call me next summer. He thought. He thought I was joking. I'm like, bro, I'm dead serious. I'm like, bro, I'm gonna play this. You know, I'm a professional, bro. I'm gonna play this year out. I was like, but mentally, bro, this shit is draining. And I was like, you know, not being able to play up to my full potential because of injuries. I was like, you know, mentally, that shit wore down on me. And so he really thought I was joking, bro. And we won the championship that year. I went on, I told him on the mic. I'm like, this is probably the last time y' all gonna see me in Europe. And so literally, bro, I got home, everybody started calling. My contract was up. I told my agent, I don't want to see no contract, no numbers, no nothing. Like, I'm serious, bro. I just need time away. And. And then, like, he's like, all right, bro, I know. I'm gonna call you October. He's at once, he's like, you gonna be ready to play by October? November? I was like, bro, I'm telling you, I'm not. I'm like, at least New Year. I'm like, bro, I ain't. I ain't entertaining nothing. And then, you know what happened? Fucking Shane Locking get hurt f his call in, like, October, yo, we got this. That. Nah, bro, I purposely stopped working out, bro, just so I wouldn't even. Like my. I had just opened the bar. So I'm locked in on the bar. I'm like, bro, I'm not even in the mental space to go. And then it just was, like, back and forth what I wanted to do. Then I started working out again, and I told him, I'm like, bro, if the right opportunity come after New Year, I'll take it. I was like, but it gotta make sense. Like, I'm not going to no shitty city. Like, gotta be decent money, whatever. And so it was people calling, but I wasn't entertaining it. Then I think Basconia called, and they offered me a lot of money. I think their point guard, they had invested in failed a drug test. I think Pierre Henry, like, failed a drug test or something. So they called. They like, yo, we need a point guard. Like, now they're like, we need somebody to come in now. We need experience. And they offered me a lot of money. And then I talked to the coach, and he just was like, yo, so how would you feel about coming here, not being a man, you know? I know. So I'm like, what you mean? He's like. I was like, bro, I just sacrificed a lot. Like, I don't know if you've seen me the last two years, but I'm trying to win. And that conversation with him, I was just like, if that's your first thing you said to me after, like, I just sacrificed all this shit the last two years and, you know, been the player who kept the team together. I played hurt. Like, it was games. I didn't take shots, but I still defended the best player on the other team. I'm like, if you didn't watch me the last two years, then you still thinking about me from three, four years ago. I'm like, yeah, nah. So I called my agent. Like, bro, I ain't gonna lie to you. Like, that conversation ain't go well. And I just feel like, you know, Basconia wasn't the best City, if I go over there, they don't have, like, ambitions to win a championship. I'm like, bro, if they say the wrong shit to me, I was like, I don't wanna be the player to just go over there for some bread. And then. You know what I mean? And I could have went and stole money. Like, I could have went a lot of places and just chilled and stole money. But, like, when I be locked in, I be locked in. So I kind of just passed on it. And so it just kind of led to, like, the next year, he called me, like, what you gonna do? I don't know, bro. Like, I'm like, give me the right opportunity. I'll do it. But then they like, well, you ain't playing a year, so you need to go. I'm like, bro, I'm not proving shit. Like, I left. I didn't leave, like, playing bad or playing like, bro, I can still hoop, and I'm in shape. They see me in shape, so it's like, they. I'm not coming there for. You know what I mean? I'm starting to do all this stuff off the court. It's like, it just gotta make sense for me to leave. And then it just, like. I just never even thought about just retiring. Just was like. Like, even still, till, you know, last summer, like, the team called, like, yo, if Malcolm and Shape, we wanna talk, like, a good team, like, if. You know, my Spanish agent's like, yo, you wanna come play in the ACB, just show everybody you back for 200, 300,000. I'm like, Bro, I mean, just. It just gotta make sense. I'm like, bro, I don't wanna go into a situation where it's like, nigga, I'm not trying to prove I know I can help somebody win. I'm watching right now. I can go over that bitch out of shape and be better than a lot. I'm sorry, that's over there now. [01:41:09] Speaker A: You still be watching the games over there? [01:41:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I watched a couple of them. So this is the first year I watched a couple. I haven't watched no Euroleague, probably for, like, the last three. 3. The season I didn't play. I wasn't watching adults, so I didn't even know what was going on. But I got a couple, you know, a couple of my friends that I catch a couple games now. But I just see, like, everybody still complaining about point guards. So it's like, nigga, I'm not about to. Like, I can help you. Like, I'm definitely not gonna hurt you. But it just. I ain't even think about like just sitting down and just like, it. It'll probably happen soon though. But I like, even right now, like, bro, I'm probably about to go just go to Europe for like a month. I just want to go, get away from here. [01:41:47] Speaker A: I seen. [01:41:49] Speaker B: Yeah, just go train and just get a fresh. This is like a breath of fresh air, bro. Just get out of. Get out of Baltimore, get out of. Get out of America, period. And then just go over there, be around basketball. It ain't even about playing or nothing like that. It's just, you know, change the scenery, just go over. So I mean, when I get over there, if I do that, then we'll see if. I mean, I don't know. [01:42:09] Speaker A: What about coaching? Is it a thought? [01:42:12] Speaker B: Not really. I would do it probably in the league if I wanted to do it. I'm not sure. I'm scared of college, bro, just because of all like the turnaround is crazy now, like how you gotta recruit and like, I. If the right situation came about, I probably would do it. I got a lot of friends now that coach, so it's like, you know, if it's something like that and I can join the staff that I know I would, you know, be productive with, then. Yeah. But I haven't been. I haven't opened up to college yet. But I definitely did have some conversations about like the NBA side chess at Virginia Tech. Yeah, they, they, they good now after this year. They. They'd be lucky to keep him after this one. They gonna have a good year. And then he got Buddy. He got Buddy to sign there. So, you know, they. He might not be there too long. [01:42:59] Speaker A: We, we, we. We can definitely end it. But one thing I want to ask before we do end it, and we normally ask early, but we know that this is nil. Nil era. If you was playing right now, how much do you think you can get? [01:43:14] Speaker B: I'll be seeing some of these kids, man. I would at least get 2 million ACC player of the year. [01:43:22] Speaker C: You good? [01:43:24] Speaker B: Yeah, we need. I mean, I'd have been. Bro, I'm. I'm seeing kids. So I'm trying to think, bro, I average like nine my freshman year. I've seen kids average nine, get 600, 000. Oh, yeah. [01:43:36] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:43:37] Speaker B: So that's what I'm like, man. I don't. I would. I, I know for a fact though, just like from some of the stuff that I was doing with like the sneakers and like, different stuff, I would have been able to, you know, I mean, if I'd have went to. I don't know if I'd have stayed at vtec, but I ain't gonna. I ain't gonna lie that for after that. After that freshman year, we'd have been. Me and Big V would have been like, man, who got the most bag? We definitely. But nah, they. Yeah, bro, I would have. Man, we. I would have racked up with. Especially if I stayed in school for four years. [01:44:08] Speaker C: That's the thing. [01:44:10] Speaker B: Yeah, Yeah, I would have. I'm mad about that. We still need to figure. They gotta figure out something with that. [01:44:17] Speaker A: They gotta figure it out. [01:44:19] Speaker C: There's no way we was just. [01:44:24] Speaker B: They making money off of what we did. That's crazy. That's why I said, bro, all these rules change. And like that draft rule changed with me. I'm just like, damn, bro. I got stuck in between all that. Then now getting. We talking about people getting paid. You never thought it was gonna happen, bro. They like, how we gonna. How they going? Now? [01:44:44] Speaker C: One of the key things is you get to transfer without sitting out. That's crucial right there. [01:44:48] Speaker B: You get to going to four, four and five schools, bro. [01:44:53] Speaker C: Get another bag. [01:44:54] Speaker B: Like, you just. You just getting contract, you getting hired. You're a contractor, right? And you just go at the highest bidder every year, bro. And it don't, bro, if you transfer back then it just was like, bro, damn, you got sit out, sit out. Like talking about how many schools you done been to now. Like, it don't you look at pictures. They got four different uniforms on. And they went prepped before that. And there's like, Damn, bro, you 26. If you was 22 in college, bro, they said, you old back then. You a senior, bro, you old is 26, 25. [01:45:31] Speaker A: Now they got to the point where you go, juco, Juco don't even count against you. [01:45:36] Speaker B: You could do a lot right now, bro. You 22 year old freshman. [01:45:40] Speaker A: I might got two years left, bro. [01:45:44] Speaker B: Yeah, I seen that. But I'm like, I see. I'm looking at the final four teams. It's like, bro, everybody 22 to 25. I'm like, bro. And you get a couple freshmen sprinkled in there. But it's like, bro, this whole team is like, damn, that's Houston for you, too. Yeah, like them Houston teams. Yeah, like San Diego State. Like them to be old. I'm like, and that's Houston. That's just. They speed. They want no freshmen. They grown ass, man. [01:46:16] Speaker C: We appreciate it. Malcolm word, man, he was hard to catch. [01:46:19] Speaker B: Up with, man. [01:46:20] Speaker C: Know you got the business, man. That's super dope too, man. Keep crushing it, man. Just. I know you was a little couple years after me, but I definitely know who you was, man. I was. You was buzzing. I had people that was overseas so I was definitely seeing you on Euro Basket. You like you said, every time I saw your name, you was elevating, man. And just speaking to you, man. I just hope good things continue, man. Keep that confidence, man. Man, to tell you I'm a confident dude. I. I love confidence. So you seem like that's how you roll. Keep it up, man. Just keep inspiring. Keep doing what you're doing with your program, man. Everything you told us and spoke on Super Dope, man. We appreciate your time, bro. [01:47:00] Speaker B: Yeah, appreciate it. Anytime, bro. [01:47:02] Speaker A: Appreciate you. [01:47:03] Speaker C: All right, well, all right. [01:47:05] Speaker A: My guys.